Hatsee wrote:

yeuxdesoir wrote:

well the fact that this isnt the only thread about how rangers need upgrades doesnt help.

 

the ranger class seems fine, especially considering that other classes are in dire need of some help. 

to continue on the heals, why should a ranger get better heals than a paladin?  if my cleric dies in t5 zones im sure as hell not gonna ask for ranger heals, id be more concerned with a real way to slavage the situation.

I think you've hit bottom then you just keep on going, interesting.

Who said that rangers want to heal better than paladins and was it even a ranger that said it? 

However ignoring your ranger hate this thread was about hybrids, rangers/bsts to be specific.  We have the same heal, so it makes sense. 

Also about your situation there, rangers even said it's not a valid way to save anything in challenging content, ranger healing the tank I mean.  The solution most of us would come up with is to taunt and WS burn it down, not to heal the tank.

 

Grbage said:

For you naysayers, it used to be a ranger and bst could (in group content) keep up a tank when the healer died. It wasn't mana effecient enough to take over the role as main healer but would do in a pinch. Starting with TSS it started getting harder to do and today it is pretty much not going to happen. Between player HP mudflation and boosted mob dps all we can do is patch heal. If you have to depend on your local bst/ranger to keep you alive good luck if that mob has any amount of HP left.

certainly seems like thats a ranger to me.

yeuxdesoir wrote:

well the fact that this isnt the only thread about how rangers need upgrades doesnt help.

 

the ranger class seems fine, especially considering that other classes are in dire need of some help. 

to continue on the heals, why should a ranger get better heals than a paladin?  if my cleric dies in t5 zones im sure as hell not gonna ask for ranger heals, id be more concerned with a real way to slavage the situation.

Where the hell did someone ask for better heals than a paladin?

I also doubt theres any more threads about rangers needing help than there is threads about any other classes asking about help.

This thread was once again brought up for more than 1 class, as was the Spell Damage nerf thread but some sh*t stain like you always tries to completely turn it into a class arguement.

Quit playing EQ because you probably suck.

But should hybrids have better healing capacity ?

Clerics standard heal is around 6k, its the focus and AAs who make it worthwhile the base heal it self is nothing.

And rangers and bsts are fine for an emergency like trowing a heal on someone who is dotted, not for healing a tank  

i dont see any other threads on the front page about other classes, but there are 2 about boosting rangers right at the top

this thread has also been dominated by 2 or 3 rangers since the first page.  if it was about beasts then where the hell are their posts? 

your resorting to petty name calling because your arguement is baseless and i just reposted the ranger saying they should be able to heal a grp. read the thread before you start insulting people like a 12 year old.

yeuxdesoir wrote:

do you seriously think a ranger and should be able to main heal a grp in any current content?

No, but I do expect both Rangers and Beast Lords to help out healing Rampage and AE damage on raids.  Thier current heals are waaay below par for this.

yeuxdesoir wrote:

i dont see any other threads on the front page about other classes, but there are 2 about boosting rangers right at the top

this thread has also been dominated by 2 or 3 rangers since the first page.  if it was about beasts then where the hell are their posts? 

your resorting to petty name calling because your arguement is baseless and i just reposted the ranger saying they should be able to heal a grp. read the thread before you start insulting people like a 12 year old.

Beasts dont really have a community nearly the size of the rangers community. As was said, this thread was started for more then the ranger class, And I also believe the other thread is by a new ranger player which should be moved to the class forum.

Thxdrivethru.

Ranilen wrote:

yeuxdesoir wrote:

i dont see any other threads on the front page about other classes, but there are 2 about boosting rangers right at the top

this thread has also been dominated by 2 or 3 rangers since the first page.  if it was about beasts then where the hell are their posts? 

your resorting to petty name calling because your arguement is baseless and i just reposted the ranger saying they should be able to heal a grp. read the thread before you start insulting people like a 12 year old.

Beasts dont really have a community nearly the size of the rangers community. As was said, this thread was started for more then the ranger class, And I also believe the other thread is by a new ranger player which should be moved to the class forum.

Thxdrivethru.

Beasts are also immune to rabies, or cure it quickly, before they start frothing at the mouth.

yeuxdesoir wrote:

i dont see any other threads on the front page about other classes, but there are 2 about boosting rangers right at the top

this thread has also been dominated by 2 or 3 rangers since the first page.  if it was about beasts then where the hell are their posts? 

your resorting to petty name calling because your arguement is baseless and i just reposted the ranger saying they should be able to heal a grp. read the thread before you start insulting people like a 12 year old.

Not our fault the beastlords dont want to help their class out and honestly i think alot of people who played beastlords have switched over to other toons due to other issues with their class.

XmortavianX wrote:

I love you too Karthos. Sorry you cant keep up with my DPS on raids, but I am pure melee and you are hybrid.

Boy I sure am glad I have that pure melee warrior alt to dps with.

yeuxdesoir wrote:

i dont see any other threads on the front page about other classes, but there are 2 about boosting rangers right at the top

this thread has also been dominated by 2 or 3 rangers since the first page.  if it was about beasts then where the hell are their posts? 

your resorting to petty name calling because your arguement is baseless and i just reposted the ranger saying they should be able to heal a grp. read the thread before you start insulting people like a 12 year old.

Grbage said:

For you naysayers, it used to be a ranger and bst could (in group content) keep up a tank when the healer died. It wasn't mana effecient enough to take over the role as main healer but would do in a pinch. Starting with TSS it started getting harder to do and today it is pretty much not going to happen. Between player HP mudflation and boosted mob dps all we can do is patch heal. If you have to depend on your local bst/ranger to keep you alive good luck if that mob has any amount of HP left.

First off can you 100% that Grbage is a ranger? NO. 2nd PLEASE PLEASE Show where in that quote you posted does it say that he wants rangers to be able to heal a group? Unless you learned a different kind of English then me i see no where in that quote that says that.

Ignorance aside, of the list of things that need attention ranger heals are pretty low on the list.  No, they haven't kept up with gear inflation but hey, neither has CH.

Paladin, and beast lord heals could use a boost though ! :p

"it used to be a ranger and bst could (in group content) keep up a tank when the healer died. It wasn't mana effecient enough to take over the role as main healer"

i must be using magical reading comprehension skills only taught to unicorns to find that nugget.

"Beasts dont really have a community nearly the size of the rangers community. As was said, this thread was started for more then the ranger class, And I also believe the other thread is by a new ranger player which should be moved to the class forum."

I agree with you there, but I guess the ire of a few wont let it die when someone diagrees with them.

Thulack-Secrecy wrote:

 

yeuxdesoir wrote:

i dont see any other threads on the front page about other classes, but there are 2 about boosting rangers right at the top

this thread has also been dominated by 2 or 3 rangers since the first page.  if it was about beasts then where the hell are their posts? 

your resorting to petty name calling because your arguement is baseless and i just reposted the ranger saying they should be able to heal a grp. read the thread before you start insulting people like a 12 year old.

Grbage said:

 

For you naysayers, it used to be a ranger and bst could (in group content) keep up a tank when the healer died. It wasn't mana effecient enough to take over the role as main healer but would do in a pinch. Starting with TSS it started getting harder to do and today it is pretty much not going to happen. Between player HP mudflation and boosted mob dps all we can do is patch heal. If you have to depend on your local bst/ranger to keep you alive good luck if that mob has any amount of HP left.

 

First off can you 100% that Grbage is a ranger? NO. 2nd PLEASE PLEASE Show where in that quote you posted does it say that he wants rangers to be able to heal a group? Unless you learned a different kind of English then me i see no where in that quote that says that.

Rangers were viable as small healers as current group content in sof.  I duoed a lot if not all of the CCF aug with myself and a warrior where I was the main healer.

Like it was said, the heals did not keep up with the inflation and npc dps in group content jumped considerably.

I apologize it was a BEAST that said it, but they have the same heals right?

yeuxdesoir wrote:

"it used to be a ranger and bst could (in group content) keep up a tank when the healer died. It wasn't mana effecient enough to take over the role as main healer"

 

i must be using magical reading comprehension skills only taught to unicorns to find that nugget.

 

"Beasts dont really have a community nearly the size of the rangers community. As was said, this thread was started for more then the ranger class, And I also believe the other thread is by a new ranger player which should be moved to the class forum."

 

I agree with you there, but I guess the ire of a few wont let it die when someone diagrees with them.

Well my take on that sentence is him saying that in group content rangers and bst's were able to deal with heals for a short part of a fight if the cleric when down in the PAST. the second sentence is just a statement saying that rangers and bst's werent capable of taking over as main healer. Still dont see him asking anywhere for rangers to be on par with clerics/druids/shammies.

fystsofury wrote:

So,  you guys think instead of healing the tank you should try and steal agro, and ws the mob down. Instead of healing?

Makes no sense to me, let 2 or more  people die just so you can maybe save the  day with  WS.  What happens when ws is down? Just let the whole grp die?

I am not one to tell another  how to play their class, but common sense speaks for itself.

edit --- I am not tryin to say these heals are spectacular or anything. I would not cause an uprise or anything if they did get a little luvin, but as they lie, they are more usefull than most want to admit.

This is the problem with the entire situation it points that only the healer died, and not why.  24 seconds of no damage taken + full dps output is better than letting someone else die... However, there's only one tank class where they don't have the innate self heal capability to survive group mob dps anyway and even Warriors have tools at their disposal to survive a mob without healing beyond a disc or potions with a respectable amount of dps around.

Bottom line, say the tank has no evasives (or deflection and out of mana), meaning they are reliant only upon a ranger's heals... the better option is to yank agro and take 24 seconds of no damage what so ever than to attempt to heal the tank with massively subpar healing that costs all dps from one of the primary damage dealers in the group.  Slower kills = more time needing to heal, more time for the disparity of low heal output to be thwarted by the mobs dps... "common sense" says rangers/beasts will lose that battle of attrition.

yeuxdesoir wrote:

I apologize it was a BEAST that said it, but they have the same heals right?

To be technical I suppose there are nearly the same heals. The same efficiency atleast. Both of which a lot of people are arguing are in adequate in todays game.

Ranilen wrote:

yeuxdesoir wrote:

I apologize it was a BEAST that said it, but they have the same heals right?

To be technical I suppose they are nearly the same heals. The same efficiency atleast. Both of which a lot of people are arguing are inadequate in todays game.

Ugh, error fixes without edit buttons

yeuxdesoir wrote:

Grbage said:

 

For you naysayers, it used to be a ranger and bst could (in group content) keep up a tank when the healer died. It wasn't mana effecient enough to take over the role as main healer but would do in a pinch. Starting with TSS it started getting harder to do and today it is pretty much not going to happen. Between player HP mudflation and boosted mob dps all we can do is patch heal. If you have to depend on your local bst/ranger to keep you alive good luck if that mob has any amount of HP left.

 

certainly seems like thats a ranger to me.

Could be, I don't know him and there is no good way to figure out what class he plays.  However if you use eqplayers you'll find someone with that name that is a bst, so let's go with that.

He is right actually, back many expansions ago we could pickup when a healer died and keep the group alive, but it was not mana efficient or even reliable at all, and you'd definitely not keep going without trying to get the healer back up.  Since then it's been declining, and I don't even think there is anyone that wants us to heal a group, what we want is to patch the group when needed and not take 25 heals to do so, or more if you are incredibly unlucky in the new expansion and we get nothing but the standard healing increase.  If you read his post again he was saying what we used to be able to do and saying it just doesn't work anymore, as in our "utility" that you keep throwing at us is slowly being made worthless, which is entirely true.

I agree that hybrids (pal/ranger/bst) all need at least a small upgrade in thier healing abilities.  Right now few rangers/beastlords I know even bother to memorize thier heal, since using it in most situations is an exorcize in futility.  In modern content at least...using SoD heals in SoF content in its emergency/patch heal capacity is actually somewhat viable in the short term.  Which imo should be a good indicator of where SoF/SoD heals should be raised to.  Likewise paladin heals should be raised an equal percentage to maintain the current heal paradigm, and give them a slight boost in all levels of play (the class needs it imo).

And really, all this does is increase the support capacity of support classes back to where it was from launch to TBS.  Were beastlords ever a threat to priest healing in DoN?  No, not at all.  But I once had one heal through a nest instance before when we couldn't find another healer.  It was slow as heck and tank ate a death or two (hurray for guild lobby introduction that expansion!), but we made it through.  So any pretences that a small (10-20%) upgrade in hybrid healing ability to keep pace with current player hp and mob dps output is a threat to priests in any way is just silly imo.

And for the record, yes I do box a ranger (main is a mage), but this is not just a ranger issue.  This affects all hybrids that missed the heal revamp.  And really, what is the harm of the folks we group with on a daily basis becoming better at thier roles, even if said role is just a small portion of the class?  I know I'd love to have our paladins on raids be able to step up a bit better if an add gets out of control and eats a druid that was helping keep the MT up.  Its frustrating to see how often folks on this board have a hard time looking past thier own class issues and oppose changes that could be very good for the game.

Anyhow, just my 2cp.  I highly doubt we'll see any changes on this front until next expansion, but there is always room for hope.

I never said anything about utility, I responded to a comment by one person and somehow got into an argument with another about the original comment.  I was then personally attacked (yay for keyboard badarses) so I restated my opinion and what I was responding to.  My only comment before that was about a vague request for a boost to healing capabilites that would keep up with current content.  even if you doubled your heal to 4k over 3 seconds with focus you probably still couldnt make up for the dmg output of mobs that can take down a 30khp tank.  Maybe the real problem is trash mobs in cod or korafax hitting harder than fos named.

anyways, this has snowballed beyond any kind of reasoning but that tends to happen when people make vague requests and others respond about what they assume was meant.

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

Let's hear it for the Uniclass!

Let's blur the line between classes, like WoW does...

Want FD and a rez, too? WHY NOT?

If you can't play your class, why not get other class skills.

 

This is BS and just more GIMME/ENTITLEMENT whining that belongs on the individual class boards.

Sorry, I love ranger and beastlords, but not people that whine and demand others' abilities cause they are not happy with their own eJohnson.

who is demanding others abilities?  It's a spell that we have had forever.  From what I have read there was nothing about asking for others abilities.  It's a simple request to ask that the heals of both classes be given a small boost.  It doesn't have to be big or anything like that but when our heals were at one time doing at least 20% health .... it's progressively gotten worse.

bulletproof69 wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

Let's hear it for the Uniclass!

Let's blur the line between classes, like WoW does...

Want FD and a rez, too? WHY NOT?

If you can't play your class, why not get other class skills.

 

This is BS and just more GIMME/ENTITLEMENT whining that belongs on the individual class boards.

Sorry, I love ranger and beastlords, but not people that whine and demand others' abilities cause they are not happy with their own eJohnson.

who is demanding others abilities?  It's a spell that we have had forever.  From what I have read there was nothing about asking for others abilities.  It's a simple request to ask that the heals of both classes be given a small boost.  It doesn't have to be big or anything like that but when our heals were at one time doing at least 20% health .... it's progressively gotten worse.

It has been toned down to a small boost from the "We used to be able to heal entire groups in non-trivial content".

EDIT ADD: Not that it matters, but I am ok with a small boost.

BroncoAndy wrote:

Ignorance aside, of the list of things that need attention ranger heals are pretty low on the list.  No, they haven't kept up with gear inflation but hey, neither has CH.

Paladin, and beast lord heals could use a boost though ! :p

CH is still used?  Terribly long cast for the high amount of dmg intake.  Even if it was given an upgrade in the base heal it would still not be used just for the long cast time

NGTV13 wrote:

Hulkling wrote:

Cactuszach wrote:

/nod. Wisdom-based Hybrid healing is too far behind.

Fixed that for ya . SK life-tap healing (innate procs + spells) is quite impressive for an Int based class, I must say. Paladin Bursts and Group heals ain't bad, but our "efficiency" heals are just as lackluster as Bst and Rng.

QFT as an SK, I'm not complaining one bit about our healing abilities. My taps crit for upwards of 5k, I can dot tap at about 600 a tick, and a couple of tap procs varying from ~100 - 1k really make it feel like the mobs aren't hitting me =)

except bond recourses cant crit heal, unless they changed the mechanics. the 600/tick dot crits dont translate into heal crits like regular lifetaps do

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

bulletproof69 wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

Let's hear it for the Uniclass!

Let's blur the line between classes, like WoW does...

Want FD and a rez, too? WHY NOT?

If you can't play your class, why not get other class skills.

 

This is BS and just more GIMME/ENTITLEMENT whining that belongs on the individual class boards.

Sorry, I love ranger and beastlords, but not people that whine and demand others' abilities cause they are not happy with their own eJohnson.

who is demanding others abilities?  It's a spell that we have had forever.  From what I have read there was nothing about asking for others abilities.  It's a simple request to ask that the heals of both classes be given a small boost.  It doesn't have to be big or anything like that but when our heals were at one time doing at least 20% health .... it's progressively gotten worse.

It has been toned down to a small boost from the "We used to be able to heal entire groups in non-trivial content".

EDIT ADD: Not that it matters, but I am ok with a small boost.

We could?  Since when?  Oh you mean in a zone that has all grey cons, of course that must be it.

I need to roll a ranger!! I want light heals, dps, tracking, tanking, massive ds pling abilityz, headshot, and free cake as well when you make one! I missed out when I made a Rogue twink back in 2000, bad choice in hindsight..

I love rangers!! <3

Mainly a joke post, no real contribution to the thread. Continue.

I must have missed out on the whole cake thing.  I was just told that I ruined my own lands and to leave theirs.

bulletproof69 wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

<snip>

It has been toned down to a small boost from the "We used to be able to heal entire groups in non-trivial content".

EDIT ADD: Not that it matters, but I am ok with a small boost.

We could?  Since when?  Oh you mean in a zone that has all grey cons, of course that must be it.

I wasn't the one who said rangers could. Ranger heals have saved my boney butt more than once, but I would never have a ranger as main healer.

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

bulletproof69 wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

 

It has been toned down to a small boost from the "We used to be able to heal entire groups in non-trivial content".

EDIT ADD: Not that it matters, but I am ok with a small boost.

We could?  Since when?  Oh you mean in a zone that has all grey cons, of course that must be it.

I wasn't the one who said rangers could. Ranger heals have saved my boney butt more than once, but I would never have a ranger as main healer.

The only time you will see a ranger as MH is in an all ranger group or if the ranger is PLing ... which doesn't happen anymore since mercs have came about.  Keep in mind that this is something of a rarity and is only found in the extremely low end of trivial content

Karthos wrote:

Why are Beastlord and Ranger heals still stuck in the dark ages?

You have to use leeches?

Beastlord's Cadmael's Mending Rk. III, 1964 hp's healed, excluding AA's, heal focus and crits.

vs

Cleric's Devout Light Rk. III, 6136 hp's healed

Beastlord primary reason to exist: DPS

Cleric primay reason to exist: Healing

You've got approximately 1/3 of a clerics heal power, while doing about 3 times a cleric's DPS.  Seems quite nicely balanced to me.  Same goes for rangers.  Infact, I think both of these classes have zero reason to whine and infact get a very good deal on heal power -- a bit too good even perhaps.

1/3 a cleric's heal power? lolololololololol

bulletproof69 wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

bulletproof69 wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

 

It has been toned down to a small boost from the "We used to be able to heal entire groups in non-trivial content".

EDIT ADD: Not that it matters, but I am ok with a small boost.

We could?  Since when?  Oh you mean in a zone that has all grey cons, of course that must be it.

I wasn't the one who said rangers could. Ranger heals have saved my boney butt more than once, but I would never have a ranger as main healer.

The only time you will see a ranger as MH is in an all ranger group or if the ranger is PLing ... which doesn't happen anymore since mercs have came about.  Keep in mind that this is something of a rarity and is only found in the extremely low end of trivial content

Then why was it claimed, pages ago, as a reason that so much better healing is deserved?

Calixto-Combine wrote:

1/3 a cleric's heal power? lolololololololol

Why do you need it? You now have 100% of a cleric's healing power. In a merc.

The game has changed, stop thinking so... 2008.

Swilver wrote:

Beastlord's Cadmael's Mending Rk. III, 1964 hp's healed, excluding AA's, heal focus and crits.

vs

Cleric's Devout Light Rk. III, 6136 hp's healed

Beastlord primary reason to exist: DPS

Cleric primay reason to exist: Healing

You've got approximately 1/3 of a clerics heal power, while doing about 3 times a cleric's DPS.  Seems quite nicely balanced to me.  Same goes for rangers.  Infact, I think both of these classes have zero reason to whine and infact get a very good deal on heal power -- a bit too good even perhaps.

clearly you play neither of those classes. Enough said.

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

Calixto-Combine wrote:

1/3 a cleric's heal power? lolololololololol

Why do you need it? You now have 100% of a cleric's healing power. In a merc.

The game has changed, stop thinking so... 2008.

I'd complain about being single but i'm sure you would reccomend a merc as my solution too. what if the merc is the one that died during a fight? think about it.

Corboy wrote:

I need to roll a ranger!! I want light heals, dps, tracking, tanking, massive ds pling abilityz, headshot, and free cake as well when you make one! I missed out when I made a Rogue twink back in 2000, bad choice in hindsight..

Here's the thing though..none of those abilities are useful in XYZ raid and therefore is useless utility for the entire class.  Look no further back than the druid dps argument when they had healing power.  Whaa this nerf doesn't let me compete for DPS anymore and makes my class useless. Seems like said utility is always useless or not worth it for everyone of the entire class in all aspects of play if player X doesn't choose to use it or sees it as "useless."

Thulack-Secrecy wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

Calixto-Combine wrote:

1/3 a cleric's heal power? lolololololololol

Why do you need it? You now have 100% of a cleric's healing power. In a merc.

The game has changed, stop thinking so... 2008.

I'd complain about being single but i'm sure you would reccomend a merc as my solution too. what if the merc is the one that died during a fight? think about it.

Then that puts you in the same boat as 12 other classes... or are you "special"? You have heals, better than most other classes, that have none.

But whats the point in having a heal if it accomplishes nothing. They might aswell take away our heal and give us more DPS

bulletproof69 wrote:

BroncoAndy wrote:

Ignorance aside, of the list of things that need attention ranger heals are pretty low on the list.  No, they haven't kept up with gear inflation but hey, neither has CH.

Paladin, and beast lord heals could use a boost though ! :p

CH is still used?  Terribly long cast for the high amount of dmg intake.  Even if it was given an upgrade in the base heal it would still not be used just for the long cast time

I use it on my bot :p

Sees atleast as much use as ranger heal.

Thulack-Secrecy wrote:

But whats the point in having a heal if it accomplishes nothing. They might aswell take away our heal and give us more DPS

Um.. have you been playing EQ with the rest of us?

I haven't had an AE spell since.. umm.. level 29, maybe? What happened to all of my stat taps? They dead-ended in the 40's, I think. Most caster classes have a line of spells to bump your.. stamina/fatigue? What's going on there?

Game evolves, classes evolve. You have heals available, either through a groupmate or a merc.

I am not trying to be argumentative here, but there was a serious paradigm shift last year witht he introduction of mercs. I'd think you'd be really happy about it, since it frees up spell gems for other things (for example, there are some situations now, where I can use a merc, where I no longer need to load pet heal spells - so I can do more DPS, yet the pet still gets healed).

Good job using spells that havent been upgraded in years as examples of useless spells but seems SoE likes to keep giving us new spells but they are lacking so please come up with a better example next time.

bulletproof69 wrote:

BroncoAndy wrote:

Ignorance aside, of the list of things that need attention ranger heals are pretty low on the list.  No, they haven't kept up with gear inflation but hey, neither has CH.

Paladin, and beast lord heals could use a boost though ! :p

CH is still used?  Terribly long cast for the high amount of dmg intake.  Even if it was given an upgrade in the base heal it would still not be used just for the long cast time

Heh.  This made me laugh.  My husband (a ranger), boxes a cleric <insert dead ranger joke here>, and he keeps CH memmed all the time and uses it nightly, based on what we are doing, of course.  In a lot of zones we play in, CH and Promised heals, with occassional HoT's from my shaman are MORE than enough to keep me alive.  I keep Aurora and a burst heal loaded while tanking and use Aurora to fill in gaps here and there and we do pretty darn decent.

Also - if for some reason our cleric and/or shaman goes down and I cannot keep myself alive because LoH is down etc, he's not burning mana trying to heal me, he's burning mana to kill the mob as quickly as possible, and if I go down, he'll taunt, WS tank it or rot root and bow it to death.  Frankly, the last time I remember him using his heal was to help me PL my shaman!

Would I care if rangers and beastlords got an increase to their healing capabilities? Nah.  It's useful and the usefulness of the heals greatly depends on the playstyle of the player.

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

I am not trying to be argumentative here, but there was a serious paradigm shift last year witht he introduction of mercs. I'd think you'd be really happy about it, since it frees up spell gems for other things (for example, there are some situations now, where I can use a merc, where I no longer need to load pet heal spells - so I can do more DPS, yet the pet still gets healed).

That doesn't help them one bit on raids, where thier patch healing is most needed.

Thulack-Secrecy wrote:

Good job using spells that havent been upgraded in years as examples of useless spells but seems SoE likes to keep giving us new spells but they are lacking so please come up with a better example next time.

Sheesh, I was using them as examples of spell lines that were discontinued. The fact that yours might still exist, but not be as strong as you'd like, should be considered a plus.

Hulkling wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

I am not trying to be argumentative here, but there was a serious paradigm shift last year witht he introduction of mercs. I'd think you'd be really happy about it, since it frees up spell gems for other things (for example, there are some situations now, where I can use a merc, where I no longer need to load pet heal spells - so I can do more DPS, yet the pet still gets healed).

That doesn't help them one bit on raids, where thier patch healing is most needed.

Ok, that makes sense.

But I do not remember using Ranger or Beasts for patch healing... Guess it is in the style of the raiding guild.

In my raiding guild, Lifeshards were always in great demand to counter AE's... Lots used potions... we had lots of rangers and beastlords, but i do not ever remember any of them, over 4 years or so, ever healing... doesn't mean they didn't, just never saw it as "needed" by the raid...

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

Thulack-Secrecy wrote:

But whats the point in having a heal if it accomplishes nothing. They might aswell take away our heal and give us more DPS

Um.. have you been playing EQ with the rest of us?

I haven't had an AE spell since.. umm.. level 29, maybe? What happened to all of my stat taps? They dead-ended in the 40's, I think. Most caster classes have a line of spells to bump your.. stamina/fatigue? What's going on there?

Game evolves, classes evolve. You have heals available, either through a groupmate or a merc.

I am not trying to be argumentative here, but there was a serious paradigm shift last year witht he introduction of mercs. I'd think you'd be really happy about it, since it frees up spell gems for other things (for example, there are some situations now, where I can use a merc, where I no longer need to load pet heal spells - so I can do more DPS, yet the pet still gets healed).

Mercs do not work if the group is full or in raids, I'd probably want to lose my heals if I could pop Flarpib out all the time to save the day, but it simply doesn't work that way.

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

Hulkling wrote:

Klonn_Darkbane wrote:

I am not trying to be argumentative here, but there was a serious paradigm shift last year witht he introduction of mercs. I'd think you'd be really happy about it, since it frees up spell gems for other things (for example, there are some situations now, where I can use a merc, where I no longer need to load pet heal spells - so I can do more DPS, yet the pet still gets healed).

That doesn't help them one bit on raids, where thier patch healing is most needed.

Ok, that makes sense.

But I do not remember using Ranger or Beasts for patch healing... Guess it is in the style of the raiding guild.

 

In my raiding guild, Lifeshards were always in great demand to counter AE's... Lots used potions... we had lots of rangers and beastlords, but i do not ever remember any of them, over 4 years or so, ever healing... doesn't mean they didn't, just never saw it as "needed" by the raid...

Take a fight like Venomlord or something, it's ae heavy depending on a few things plus wild ramp and the like.  I usually end up spot healing on that one to help the shaman out, or at times that they die mid event they can get some mana back and get into it again but there is that delay where you need to keep people up depending on the event.  Most of my heals I don't use on myself, however I'd still hate to lose them completely or see them made worthless.

Someone should mention bard healing & comparisons about it increasing VS other classes heals increasing.

Pretty funny, if you don't play one.