So my question to the forum poster with more experience in playing different toons:
I only play one toon, my paladin, so I have no real data here.
Why am I asking?
I had a person in a group ask me how long I have played my Paladin and after I told him over 9 years he was flabbergasted. Asked me why I played the worst class in the game for so long. Told him it was my first toon I don't have allot of time to play and still have fun playing him.
He is a six boxer and has claimed to have toons of every class and the pally is the last toon he thinks about, he has them all at 85 but admitted the pally has only about 200 AAs.
I asked him what about paladins made them the worst and he said:
Solo
6boxer: Soloing anything other then undead, and there is not much of that in the new expansion, is painstakingly slow and he was lucky to grind 3 aas during a lesson.
Me: I can get 4 maybe 5 max on LotD and I was over 700AAs so you should be able to do a little better.
6boxer, Might be true I only did it 2 or 3 times to get the data, other than that I leveled him to 85 in the group.
Group
6Boxer: If you are looking for a tank for a group paladins are the last pick, sure they can tank most of the same mobs as other tanks but in argo/hate, dps, and pulling paladins are at the bottom of the list.
Me: I can usually hold argo
6boxer - ya if there is only one mob you should do fine, but one bad pull and your group is dead. I would use a merc before a pally as main tank if I didnt 6 box.
Raid
6 boxer: You only need 1 paladin in a raid for brells, other than that and possibly cures in some raids Other classes trump pallies again.
Me: Well I like my paladin and don't plan to start another toon to replace him
I love playing the Holy Warrior and don't want to get rid of him so starting up a new toon to box with him is what I will probably do.
Thanks in advance for your replies
paladins pretty much suck right now.
berserkers are still pretty bad off in the grp game even with frenzy fixes it hasnt solved the problem.
bards seem to have been forgotten altogether
rogues may need to be dbl checked
bards? but, they're massive utility! what happened?
Every class is both the best and the worst...depending on your point of view and what you want to do in EQ. The point of the game is to have fun and if you have fun with your Paladin then you are accomplishing your goal.
As far as 2 boxing combos with a Paladin pre-mercs I would have said Shaman, now I'd say enchanter. The reason is both enchanter and shaman can slow/haste and before you would use the shaman for heals. Now with mercs, the enchanter will help with pulling and mez any adds you do get and it's a good setup if you ever decide to 3 box.
Good 3 box combos would be enchanter + wizard or enchanter + druid. Adding a druid or wizard to the enchanter ads nuke DPS, teleports, and snares. The druid is less DPS than the wizard but the skin line of buffs helps everyone with mana regen, you get Flight of Eagles, Damage shields, etc. Having the enchanter gives the druid/wiz permenant clarity and mana regen buff + Mana Reiterate to boost DPS. I personally love the Enchanter + druid combo, it gives you just about every utility in the game.
Worst Solo: Rogue
Worst Group: Necro
Worst Raid: Beastlord
I have my ranger main and then my chanter and shaman on a different account. Depending on the mood I might play either the chanter or the shaman. I don't care to box a lot so it's usually one of the three for whatever the group I'm in might need. My ranger is the only one that raids constantly. I'll occassionally bring in the chanter for when the raid needs an extra one but again.... I never box a raid
bulletproof69 wrote:
so this guy knows very little about each class? The 6-boxer is only concerned about dps. More than likely he is using a mage pet to do his tanking or a merc... Having very little aa on his pally I'm sure he isn't seeing the benefit of having a pally around. Pally are far from the worst class in the game
That's one of the key issues... Box players do not dedicate skill to playing characters, the more "set and forget" a character is, the better. Throughout my life as a Paladin (10 years), Solo'ing actually generated faster AA than grouping... 3 things melded that made it possible (Self Healing, Tanking, Undead DPS on par with top classes).
Up until about 80, we retain all three of those aspects, when properly geared/aa'd against the comparison target. Recently, our healing has been replaced by mercs, our dps has been marginalized further by a dev team that is terrified of 'multplicative' effects so much that they'd rather just cripple people til any pile of crap they put out is received as a god send.
The problem always has been, and will continue to be, that Paladins require more skill to play exceptionally well than most classes within EQ. When played hard, using our strengths, we're a devastating force. When played by the TV-faced, ADD generation that generally picks up Paladins (but should have picked warriors), our class looks absolutely pathetic because half our tools go to waste.
I wont disagree there are times I grow frustrated with the fact that the developers still haven't learned how to balance a melee class without diving screaming behind bland +straight dmg mods and whining of multiplicative effects of Slay Undead being 'too powerful'. I'll admit life was better a couple years ago, however I strongly disagree we're one of the worst classes in the game.
SoloingIts true that paladin DPS is low against non-undead, which effects soloing efficiency. Though I expect paladins can make use of their high survivability.
GroupingI thought in groups a paladin group heal is good for AoE aggro. With stuns a paladin is excellent at holding aggro against single targets.
RaidingKnights (paladins and shadow knights) are in demand for offtanking adds. With their self healing and good sustained damage mitigation they make good tanks for trash clearing.
Like most classes there is a big difference between a well played paladin and a poorly played one. Since you are still enjoying playing your paladin after 9 years I expect you are one of the well played ones.
Kyuso wrote:
There's nothing like a well played bard. Great to have in a group.
Nolrog wrote:
Kyuso wrote:bards? but, they're massive utility! what happened?There's nothing like a well played bard. Great to have in a group.
/agree
Thanks all great replies - and totally on topic, I think your are right about the "slanted view" of this boxer
Looks like I'll have my team be:
Paladin - w/Merc Healer
and either a shammy, or chanter w/merc tank
Shammy= better buffs set
Chanter - MEZ!
any further advice?
BobV wrote:
Thanks all great replies - and totally on topic, I think your are right about the "slanted view" of this boxerLooks like I'll have my team be:Paladin - w/Merc Healerand either a shammy, or chanter w/merc tankShammy= better buffs setChanter - MEZ!any further advice?
Go a bit further with that mez.... STUN!!!
Shammy is ALWAYS a good idea for a box. Great heals, great buffs, great debuffs, decent DPS...
But, another option, for 'big go boom' DPS would be a good ole wizzie. They're pretty easily automated (just have to mouse over and hit the nuke button) and pump out serious DPS
I need to learn my shammy a bit more for him to be really effective. I've gotten my chanter down really well but the whole dedicated healer thing keeps getting me. I keep wanting to stack a load of dots and forget to heal lol. That and my shammy needs to get a ton more aa to really be effective at that level. I wouldn't mind trying out one of those pure melee or maybe a pure caster (other than chanter) at some point in time though
Group:
Paladin the worst tank for group? Mmmh looks to me that if you chain pull, the warrior will run out of endurence (if you have a good dps team that can generate lot of aggro) way faster than the knights. In case of non trivial content (depending of your gear, or if you're overgeared and you pull trains to kill faster), the sk can ae aggro / burst dps if needed and the paladin can backheal / self heal if needed. So paladin is far from being the least wanted in a group situation. With new nukes paladins can generate lot of aggro faster than any class for the ratio of aggro/ressource generated (mana/endurence), which is what matter in a group environment (so you don't have to do 29038203 med breaks), and in case of a bad pull, you generally don't need to cast more than 1 stun / nuke on adds to keep aggro if the dps isn't spread among the adds.
Raid:
This 6 boxer is clueless, old raids where you beat one target and pray the warrior keeps aggro or survives is the past. The paladin self heal ability are very important, for offtanking. Only for a few mobs another class "could" replace them. He needs to tell us which other classes on which events replaces paladins for offtanking stuff.
Solo:
Paladin are better soloers than rogue or clerics, even on living mobs.
In the end, PLing a toon to 85 doesn't mean you have any clue how a class is working.
Worst Solo - RogueWorst Group - NecroWorst Raid -
In my opinion the worst raid classes are, by far, melee DPS. Monks, Rogues and Zerkers do not blow away other classes. They beat them, sometimes. If a zerker's big disc is down he suffers. (Aura is great though) Rogues need position. Monks DPS if only good. Sustained fights they all do nothing special. Melee resistant mob, they do 0. So basically you have these classes that do one thing, Burst DPS and they are not that great at it. I mean 10% more then other classes if your lucky? This is balance?
Look at tanks, they are the only ones who can tank, you won't put a Rogue or Wizard in a tanking situation. Same with healing. They have zero competition or replacability. However, DPS is given to all. The edges in DPS are small. You are trading that in for heals, cures, track, pets, spell book, gate, track, CC, para, buffs, pulling etc etc.
It just is not worth it.
The Zerker is a pure DPS class with an Aura, he should have a substantial DPS advantage in burst DPS and an advantage on sustained DPS. The Rogue is in the same boat, they do get Super Invisibility and escape (every 32 minutes), however without position they do Warrior DPS and NEED bards and shaman to compete with other classes. The monk does get to pull, seems to mitigate well, gets some self cures and mend and excellent survivability. However these abilities should put him below Rogue/Zerker, not even with Rng, Bsts with the shaman/bard in group.
The sad thing is, if you ask players, even Beasts and Rangers, if they agree, they will say "yes." The developers are just really blinded by top guild parses where they put shaman/bard in group and it's a parsable fight. The % of fights where DPS is a factor varies from expansion to expansion.
If you are not a cutting edge guild raiding with 54 people you will be better served with hybird type classes.
Paladins are agood class, bottom line is they can do all their tanking jobs, hold aggro and heal a group. That is plenty.
Additionally, any boost to melee dos will be and should be a boost to bards.
Shaman have a knock back root that's good for CC. They also slow, which is important and can DPS and add to your DPS.
Chanter can mez and slow as well, and can add DPS if you want to try charming (though, it's difficult enough doing that when you're playing one character.) They also have a nice aura that adds something like 5% XP.
That's way more than I get as a shaman soloing - in Tosk, with Lesson, I consider it a good day if I get 3 AAs.
In a really good place, such as the top of the robot or Beza, I can get around 4 AAs.
I hadn't realised that was so crappy TBH.
SoloGroupRaidWhat class sucks teh most?!
What class sucks teh most?!
Rogues are the obvious answer
Necromancers or druids. Can't really decide which.
Beastlords are kind of weak here.
Paladins do not suck. Well, actually, pretty much all paladins I group with kinda suck. But I'm assuming it's the players that suck, not the class.
Paladins are very useful in raid setting actually. As for solo... I imagine they can solo decently against undead content. Not so much in live content. To be an efficient soloer vs live mobs you need DPS. DPS = XP.
Yer right about the slanted view of the boxer.
As an endgame raid Warrior main, I refer playing my Paladin in groups and soloing (however you should take into account a big discrepency in gear, AA's, and 5 additional levels favoring the Warrior).
The Paladin can tank all group content an equally geared Warrior can tank. They've been able to do so since DoN. In some content he can Root CC, Mercs aren't great healers - they make numerous errors, ....
In regular group content, he's more than acceptable - including his DPS.
But in undead content he shines. Thank you SOE for Fabled Blade of War, DMG+7 augs dropping in group content, SU, Benediction, Halt the Dead, etc. and WoS undead Murkgliders. The Estate of Unrest revanp was pretty sweet too although tenporary.
Nod - there is a limited amount of content that's absolutely tailored for the Paladin class (from about level 55 all the way to gives exp at level 85). There does not appear to be any much content specifically tailored for Warriors given Warriors, Pallies, and SK's can tank all group content (there may be a mob or two that poses a special challenge for Knights).
Tank? Check
DPS? lowish but pretyy nice vs. undead and there's undead to be found.
Priest? 90% res is not totally useless despite Mercs. Nor are heals or cures.
OK, Paladins (like Warriors) are misrable pullers. We've found an actual shortcoing. One.
No argument there! Was just curious what brought on the sentiment that had me so confused.
Ya, if you can manage the attention you have to pay boxing the class, both Bards and SK's perform better than classes that only have one or two notes on their skills piano.
If I were the OP, I'd go with Pally, Shaman, a Cleric Merc, and a Tank Merc (a little heavy on healing, but that's OK). If I didn't have a Pally, I'd go with SK, Shaman, a Cleric Merc, and a Tank Merc since healing is more than adequate and it's nice to have a puller.
To a boxer, especially a 6 boxer, a pally may be a bad choice.
It's all about upkeep requirements and splitting your focus. As such, you want to avoid high upkeep classes and those that require attention, regardless of their relative power levels.
This is probably why your friend avoided paladins. Just too much involved to play them effectively. Many people have the same issue when playing bards.
Chances are he has a routine. Routines allow you to control the encounter, and prioritize actions. If I were to guess:
a) Pull mob with Monk or SK. Monk offers decent AFK DPS and gives you a puller if you need it for the content. SK's offer decent pulls, and prevent the need to swap between tank & puller (less overall coordination).
b) Establish aggro with tank.
c) Debuff the mob (aka Slow). Shaman are great at this, and offer the chance to provide a quick heal to your tank while you're on the toon. Shaman also offer some good CC in the form of VP.
d) Set DPS. The key is semi-AFK DPS, or moderate refresh DPS (less button pushing). Pet classes & wizards are awesome for this.
e) Confirm aggro as necessary. Burn as needed.
Pallies, just conflict with the above, in many ways, which doesn't make them the first choice. Bards, although massively powerful in the right hands have similar restrictions. That doesn't make them the worst class, just not optimal for a specific purpose.
Enchanters get a knockback root aa but the root only lasts a few seconds, its mainly long enough to get off a mez and hope they aren't immune to run speed changes...
As for druids being the worst in a group setting? I have to disagree, druids can heal, buff, and dps... how is that bad for a group?
Solo: rogues absolutly
group: necros, but they aren't bad to have around, if something goes wrong they can fd and rez later, they aren't horrible group dps and they can pull if you can't find someone else to do it
raids: it really depends on the raid imo.
Am I crazy? Does my raid have EQ's best beastlord ever? How can people call beastlord the worst in raids?
yeah well paladin class sux, this is nothing new.
No tanking advantage, warrior mitigate much better, sk have more way to mitigate dmg (so much for being the defensive knight).
Our healing sucks, fact that our 1sec heal heals now for much less than a sk LT, and we only get access to 85% focus while sk get 90% and can double crit.
Our curing has stagnated, and is only okis to cure yourself.
Rez farmed to everyone.
Stun mitigated by everything over lvl cap, and many immune mob under cap.
Brell LINE has become a drop in the bucket.
Paladin s LIVE(2Kish burn) and undead dps(4k5ish burn) is so lame, that not attacking barely make a diff, when sk druid etc and other non dps class just dps more than us by a good margin on undead, and do triple our dps on live, something is seriously broken.
List could go on, but heh, why bother....
The only decent ability a paladin have nowadays is LoH.
paladins have a unicorn mount.
I would advise against enchanter box. Hard to play one well if boxing.
You also have no dps. Don't come complaining to us when you can't kill Hanvar at 85.
Survey_ wrote:
Worst Solo: RogueWorst Group: NecroWorst Raid: Beastlord
agreed.
Wyvernwill wrote:
... Box players do not dedicate skill to playing characters, the more "set and forget" a character is, the better...
I take issue with that part of your post. Ineffective boxers utilize that mentality, but in order to box effectively, one has to be acutely aware of the abilities of the class. Utilizing the hotkeys available to us and our hotbar, it is very possible to create a box team that will act very much like a well honed group of however many players are being boxed. Each hotkey is five lines of command that continue to fire even when you window out. Knowing what to expect from specific encounters and how to mitigate those effects with the characters on your box team takes significant skill and understanding. It most certainly does NOT take more (or less) understanding than playing a single character highly effectively.
Now, I will qualify that statement by saying that I two-box usually, cleric and necromancer. I have recently added a third account, a shaman, and learning the shaman and how to effectively add her into the mix has proven significantly difficult. However, when two boxing, it is most certainly possible to play both characters effectively.
Another, more often ignored, trick to boxing is knowing when to choose between characters to maximize the effectiveness of the group/raid you're a part of. Tank's getting destroyed, ignore the necromancer and focus on being a cleric for a few seconds. Mob needs dead, but tank isn't taking much damage - hit the HoT hotkey and focus on being a necromancer for a few seconds. It's that kind of interplay that makes boxing effectively challenging.
minimind wrote:
They just don't scale all that well. I'm guessing he's fairly well AA'd. Let's say you and him both were sitting on 3000AA, with weapons around the tier you have on magelo. It'd be close when your SS wasn't up sure. And on longer fights as well. If otoh you had Crystallos+ weapons, and he did as well, it wouldn't be so close anymore. You'd gain massively from that upgrade since almost all your DPS is weapon based. His gains wouldn't be as large, with him having warder, spells, etc making up a proportionally larger part of his DPS than frenzy and volley does of yours.
Solo: Paladins suck. Simple as that. Undead or not. They suck. Not the absolute worst of all classes, but in the bottom 3. Soloing as a Paladin, while it can be done, is not efficient and the XP is bleh, at best.
Group: For tanks, Paladins are at the bottom of the barrel for a group. Warriors out tank every class. SKs have great AE aggro ability and are very useful on multiple pulls. Paladins can tank one mob just as well as an SK, but our AE aggro ability is virtually nonexistent (see below). We do have root though, which can come in handy with a good puller who knows what they are doing.
Raid: Paladins are effective off-tanks in a raid setting, that's true. But SKs are significantly better. There's very very few situations where you wouldn't be better off with an SK off-tanking than a Paladin. Their only real benefit is their curing ability, which SKs don't have. SKs can tap for their health.
As for using Paladin group heals as aggro tools...well that's about the stupidest thing the Devs currently make Paladins do. And...the aggro is minimal and sketchy at best. These group heals were designed and implemented to be just that...HEALS! Not AE aggro tools for multiple mobs. And, if you consider in a group setting, everyone is virtually full health when that multiple pull comes in and aggro needs to be gained very quickly or people die, your mostly wasting the healing side of it. I've been playing a Paladin for 9+ years now and I use my heals for AE aggro only as a last resort.
Paladins have two real advantages over the other 2 tanks and maybe 3 depending on mob level:
And
Otherwise, get an SK or Warrior to do the job and you'll be better at it, whether group or raid.
Raid 6 boxer: You only need 1 paladin in a raid for brells, other than that and possibly cures in some raids Other classes trump pallies again.
What is the worst all around class right now? Paladin.
Allthough just as few other classes a well played one brings up their Value a tad.
For boxing a warrior would easier and better suit their needs imo.
It could be that the paladins I know are amazing and the sks are not, but I have always though of Pal > Sk especially in groups. I've never had a pally ask for a med break, which the SKs and Warriors do constantly.
Pal is my first choice in groups.
As far as solo goes though, I have no clue. Raids though I have never seen pallies outdone by anyone else in their roles. (offtank, secondary tank)
The beastlords that I raid with don't even consider themselves dps. I attribute it to the poor community beastlords have. No one really cares enough to get the word out to other beastlords about how to dps properly with the significant amount of tools they have.
IMO, all melee dps classes including beastlords can all top a parse but the classes that generally care about their class do better than average. That's why you see monks and rangers atop parses and beastlords etc do poorly.
You raid demiplane at level 85, things are different when you aren't raiding top end content when it's current.
Karthos wrote:
minimind wrote:Am I crazy? Does my raid have EQ's best beastlord ever? How can people call beastlord the worst in raids? The beastlords that I raid with don't even consider themselves dps. I attribute it to the poor community beastlords have. No one really cares enough to get the word out to other beastlords about how to dps properly with the significant amount of tools they have.IMO, all melee dps classes including beastlords can all top a parse but the classes that generally care about their class do better than average. That's why you see monks and rangers atop parses and beastlords etc do poorly.
Bst's can't top a parse, they can do well but they wont top a parse. This could be because they are like monks in that 95% of them just suck, but I'd be willing to accept that perhaps the class has issues.
0.o
In order of most messed up class I'd go.
Bard
Zerker
Monk
Rogue
Far as Tanks go none of them are that bad off. Any of the three tank classes can go any of the group stuff. All have advatages and disadvatages.
SK can pull snare FD and holds very very good agro.
Pally can kill undead , heal and buff and rez in a pinch
Warr has best disc's for damage mitigation and does more sutained DPS.
Anyone that puts any tank class as the worse off in EQ needs their head checked.
Hatsee wrote:
Karthos wrote:minimind wrote:Am I crazy? Does my raid have EQ's best beastlord ever? How can people call beastlord the worst in raids? The beastlords that I raid with don't even consider themselves dps. I attribute it to the poor community beastlords have. No one really cares enough to get the word out to other beastlords about how to dps properly with the significant amount of tools they have.IMO, all melee dps classes including beastlords can all top a parse but the classes that generally care about their class do better than average. That's why you see monks and rangers atop parses and beastlords etc do poorly.Bst's can't top a parse, they can do well but they wont top a parse. This could be because they are like monks in that 95% of them just suck, but I'd be willing to accept that perhaps the class has issues.
Lots of classes will never top a parse, but beastlords do just fine in my guild (tower on farm). We have 2 active beastlords, and if one gets into a melee dps group they'll be in the top 6 or 7... probably beating some rangers who are also in dps groups. It's all about how you play your class, but saying beastlords suck in the raid game is a bit hasty considering the things they bring to the table.
Plus we've gotten the friggin monk/bst weapon 4 out of 4 tower clears... thing went to an app this week because we're out of main monks and beastlords now.
Yoscorio wrote:
Hatsee wrote:Karthos wrote:minimind wrote:Am I crazy? Does my raid have EQ's best beastlord ever? How can people call beastlord the worst in raids? The beastlords that I raid with don't even consider themselves dps. I attribute it to the poor community beastlords have. No one really cares enough to get the word out to other beastlords about how to dps properly with the significant amount of tools they have.IMO, all melee dps classes including beastlords can all top a parse but the classes that generally care about their class do better than average. That's why you see monks and rangers atop parses and beastlords etc do poorly.Bst's can't top a parse, they can do well but they wont top a parse. This could be because they are like monks in that 95% of them just suck, but I'd be willing to accept that perhaps the class has issues. Lots of classes will never top a parse, but beastlords do just fine in my guild (tower on farm). We have 2 active beastlords, and if one gets into a melee dps group they'll be in the top 6 or 7... probably beating some rangers who are also in dps groups. It's all about how you play your class, but saying beastlords suck in the raid game is a bit hasty considering the things they bring to the table. Plus we've gotten the friggin monk/bst weapon 4 out of 4 tower clears... thing went to an app this week because we're out of main monks and beastlords now.
By no means are they awful, but if you had enough rogues/zerkers/rangers/wizards/necros/monks you'd never see them in the top spots on a parse. They simply do okay, which is kind of bad when the only thing most of us do anymore is dps.
This depends - true solo yeah rogues are easily the weakest of the bunch. Infact all pure melee kinda suck here as no heals and not viable to kite, but rogues have directional penalties and weaker tanking than others.
However factor in mercs and possibly pally is indeed weak now if all you're interested in is XP. With a merc I (a rogue) solo OK and we can dish out *reasonable* dps. Nothing major, maybe 5-6AA in a molo lessons burn in valdeholm say with crystallos level raid gear. That's likely more than a pally could do, but WAY down on rangers, necros, wiz, etc etc.
On tough mobs, so after solo loot rather than XP, pallies are nowhere near the bottom of the pile solo - infact they'd be close to the top. They can tank some pretty tough mobs and with a merc can solo well - it's just slow and tedious. But hey - you're a TANK class. It wasn't meant to be fast, just safe. Expecting both dps and tanking is clearly just wrong.
Well necro is the obvious choice as many have said, although they're not THAT bad. Depends on the kill speed of the group basically and whether they have multiple off-tanked mobs or just burning 1 at a time with efficient pulling or CC. Their utility in group is somewhat limited too.
Tricky one. People suggested beastlords and that's probably reasonable. Then again I have to think - hybrid "jack of all trades" class... did you expect it to excel in any one specific area, more than others? The fact is the min/max-ers out there won't like beastlords as there's always a class that is better than them at whatever role you're trying to fit. So maybe they need a bit of tweaking, but it's not massively broken IMO.
I don't think it's a coincidence though that the recent data-mining of eqplayers showed necros and rogues as losing ground fast in the number of active players, with beastlords relatively low on a percentage played too. The facts sort of speak for themselves there.
It seems every raid force is different. Generally this is what we see at the MMM level. We are working on clearing crystallos.
Wizard>Monk>Ranger>Rogue>Zerker>Bard>Warrior>SK>Beastlord
Lots of classes will never top a parse, but beastlords do just fine in my guild (tower on farm). We have 2 active beastlords, and if one gets into a melee dps group they'll be in the top 6 or 7... probably beating some rangers who are also in dps groups.
This is what I am curious about. When the Bst/Rng is in a DPS group, what is edge of Rog/Zerker over those Bst/Rng?
In burst and sustained fights?I am not doing SoD raids (past the junior ones) and I am curious about the high enders.
My theroy is if (ie) a Rogue is (ie) 10% ahead of Rangers on burns and behind Rangers on Sustained fights, it seems like the Rogue is the most screwed class in EQ and this is a result of parses having so much weight in the devs eyes. Everything else, track, Range DPS, Taunt, Mitigation, Sustained fights, heals, Buffs, CC, Cures, Pulling, Entire spellbook, rear arc etc, mean nothing.
*I understand that weapons, skill, AA can vary, however you can usually account for this in your estimates.
Liethi wrote:
minimind wrote:Am I crazy? Does my raid have EQ's best beastlord ever? How can people call beastlord the worst in raids? They just don't scale all that well. I'm guessing he's fairly well AA'd. Let's say you and him both were sitting on 3000AA, with weapons around the tier you have on magelo. It'd be close when your SS wasn't up sure. And on longer fights as well. If otoh you had Crystallos+ weapons, and he did as well, it wouldn't be so close anymore. You'd gain massively from that upgrade since almost all your DPS is weapon based. His gains wouldn't be as large, with him having warder, spells, etc making up a proportionally larger part of his DPS than frenzy and volley does of yours.
This is actually a good point, melee get most of their power from weapons. So a guild behind the curve will always have better casters > Hybird caster > Melee.Those classes benefit from the newest spells while the melee discs dont really upgrade.I am using the same DPS discs on the Rogue I always have been.
minimind wrote:Am I crazy? Does my raid have EQ's best beastlord ever? How can people call beastlord the worst in raids?You raid demiplane at level 85
You raid demiplane at level 85
I do?
