Ok so im pretty frustrated and downright embarressed with my bruiser right now. I love him to death solo, and when i dps in a group. Typically im first in dps in groups and solo? its a breeze. But there are some issues that are really hurting me in regards to the group aspect.

First issue:  Power

Yup i dont know what im doing wrong but i run out of power really fast.Not sure why this may be, im guessing because my gear dosnt have any power regen on it? that coupled with constanlt spamming my cas i just run low or out alot. Is this a common problem as a bruiser? how do i go about counteracting this problem?

Second issue:Tanking for a group

This is the part that really is embarressing. I am horrible at tanking. Several levels of my horribleness include losing aggro alot, cant seem to pull aggro off people, when i do pulls i seem to pull pretty much 5 to 6 at a time. Ok disclaimer here. Until just now my taunts were app 1. I never figured id tank so i never upgraded them. Just now upgraded to adept 1. Now as far as i can tell about tanking is you pull then you have 2 taunts? well they arnt really taunts just aggro buiolders. A single target and an encounter? Is this correct in the only tools i have to keep aggro? what do you do to actually taunt a mob off of a group member? I cant seem to figure that one out. How do you pull just 1 mob out of a group of mobs? Arrghh this tanking thing gave me a migrane srsly. I could just as easily say i suck im not tanking ever again, but well im a bruiser tanking is sorta my job. So i need help.

Last issue:How to learn to tank better in game?

On my server the groups are pretty few and far between. At 80 there are plenty but until then pretty few. So this dosnt really give me much oppurtunity to practice on tanking. What should i do about this? anything i can do while questing soloing that might improve my tank skills? im guessing no but id figure id ask.

Welp thats all for now. I fully admit im a bad tank but i want to improve trust me i dont want to be known as bad. Now i know some is practice and ive tanked maybe 3 times from 1 to 72 but i still would like to know the fundamentals. Thank you if you read this and all or any advice or critisism.

Fatshadow@Unrest wrote:

Ok so im pretty frustrated and downright embarressed with my bruiser right now. I love him to death solo, and when i dps in a group. Typically im first in dps in groups and solo? its a breeze. But there are some issues that are really hurting me in regards to the group aspect.

First issue:  Power

Yup i dont know what im doing wrong but i run out of power really fast.Not sure why this may be, im guessing because my gear dosnt have any power regen on it? that coupled with constanlt spamming my cas i just run low or out alot. Is this a common problem as a bruiser? how do i go about counteracting this problem?

Second issue:Tanking for a group

This is the part that really is embarressing. I am horrible at tanking. Several levels of my horribleness include losing aggro alot, cant seem to pull aggro off people, when i do pulls i seem to pull pretty much 5 to 6 at a time. Ok disclaimer here. Until just now my taunts were app 1. I never figured id tank so i never upgraded them. Just now upgraded to adept 1. Now as far as i can tell about tanking is you pull then you have 2 taunts? well they arnt really taunts just aggro buiolders. A single target and an encounter? Is this correct in the only tools i have to keep aggro? what do you do to actually taunt a mob off of a group member? I cant seem to figure that one out. How do you pull just 1 mob out of a group of mobs? Arrghh this tanking thing gave me a migrane srsly. I could just as easily say i suck im not tanking ever again, but well im a bruiser tanking is sorta my job. So i need help.

Last issue:How to learn to tank better in game?

On my server the groups are pretty few and far between. At 80 there are plenty but until then pretty few. So this dosnt really give me much oppurtunity to practice on tanking. What should i do about this? anything i can do while questing soloing that might improve my tank skills? im guessing no but id figure id ask.

Welp thats all for now. I fully admit im a bad tank but i want to improve trust me i dont want to be known as bad. Now i know some is practice and ive tanked maybe 3 times from 1 to 72 but i still would like to know the fundamentals. Thank you if you read this and all or any advice or critisism.

 

1. Power issue. What kind of armor do you wear? If it's MC or above, then it's not your gear IF it's all fighter gear....STR/AGI/STA, in that order. What is an example of how fast you run out? We do burn through power due to our reliance on the CA's. If you have ACT parse, you can figure out when you auto-attack, and space your CA's in between them...that will save you power as you won't have to spam CA's as much.

2. Tanking. Well, we have a problem tanking in the last 2 expansions unless you are well equipt. So, if you MC, then it will be tough til you get some better gear. As far as taunts, and agro holdin, it's a problem for us. The issue is that, in regular gear...meaning not uber....there is a problem.

We generate agro through our damage primarly. So, if we are tanking, we need to stay in offensive stance or our hate sucketh. However, we are not avoiding much, as avoidance tanks , so we take alot of damage....spike damage. But, even with generating good hate, we need to work at keeping agro.

3. Hints for keepin agro.

1. Learn the BODY PULL and do it well        That means just inch up til the ONE encounter reacts to you, then get back to your camp. If you do this, you should avoid multiple encounters MOST of the time.

2. Good job getting ad1's  Think about AD'3s now.

3. Once you BODY PULL the encounter, lets say there are 3 mobs in it, hit your GROUP AE taunt and an AE CA to piss all of em off. Then, hit one mob fer a few hits and taunt, then go to the next mob and hit a few times and taunt ,then the next and hit and taunt....go back to the first one and finish off. Thats a general idea. You also have Crane something...AA CA under the WIS line....get that. Also, use DIVIDE and CONQUER as well.

You will still lose agro at times...if/when you do, you have RESCUE and through the AA's, you have another snap agro thing that works great. Also, one regular way is to save your Knock Down CA's for gettin agro back. The mobs get real pissed when you knock them down, and they should come to you aftre that and some other hits.

Another Tankin tip is to save your stuns.knockdowns for spacing them out. If your healer needs to catch up to your damage, hit the mob with a stun, and you get a little time to get healed.

Oh...there are lotts more tips, im sure others will advise better than me...but maybe those will help a little bit. GET T! shard armor ASAP.

Power. 

 Power is definetley going to be an issue for you if you spam CAs.  First off, i'd suggest getting a phantom pith adornment on one or both of your weapons if power is a big issue for you.  Often power problems are resolved by members of your group, like an illusionist or coercer.   If you don't have anyone giving power then your going to have to rely on gear and items like Manastone.  

  I'd suggest getting Advanced Combat Tracker.  http://advancedcombattracker.com/

Advanced combat tracker is the ultimate tool in helping you play the game better.  It is a parser that once you learn, you can do just about anything with it.  In the bruiser section on eq2flames, I have a thread all about ACT Triggers, and how to get the most out of your parser.  If you are spamming combat arts, you are likely interrupting the natural flow of your auto attacks, and wasting potential DPS (Which may be why you have trouble holding aggro).  Use ACT to time your CA's and you will notice a great improvement in DPS, and you will also consume less power. 

Tanking.

Tanking well and holding aggro can be rough.   It's certainly harder than just DPS ing, after all if you suck at DPS'ing it doens't get people killed, where if you can't hold aggro, people will die.  Here are some tips. 

Taunts - Taunts right now are not very usefull.  The threat they generate is minimal, and 9 out of 10 times, simply hitting a normal CA gives you more hate than a taunt.  As bruisers, we have high DPS potential and that is generally how we hold aggro, through damage.   At base value, every point of damage you deal, also gives you 1 point of hate, so DPS'ing is just overall better than relying on Taunts.   You can use taunts when pulling a mob (Be careful of social aggro though!), because taunst do work at range.   You can use Taunts when all other abilities are down, as they cast very fast, and lastly you can use taunts if you have a troubador in your group who casts precision or the Maestro, or some other group ability that procs from spells.   You see, in terms of proccing group procs, Taunts count as spells.  Oh, and if you have a mythical coercer in your group, he can make your taunts also deal damage, so thats something to keep in mind. 

  Keep aggro - If you are pulling 1 mob at a time, holding aggro should be easy, simply stay aggressive and do as much damage as you can.  You shouldn't loose aggro when grouping with players of similar gear and skill, if you are pulling single target mobs.  Also, make sure that you have all applicable hate transfers.   Dirges, Coercers, Assasins, and Swashbucklers are all good classes that can increase your hate.  Wizards, Warlocks, and even monks can also boost your hate but in a smaller amount.  Also keep your aggro buff up, I'm sure you do but I felt obligated to mention that. 

  If you are pulling multiple targets, try to limit your pulls to a single linked encounter.   Pulling Multiple encounters can get very confusing.  If you pull one encounter of lets say, 3 mobs, you will likely have to tab through the mobs to ensure that they are all still beating on you.   I tend to focus on one, but give each other mob an occasional punch or kick to make sure they remember who's boss.  If you pull multiple encounters you are going to need to rely on your Blue AoE abilities to try and keep the mobs on you.   Tabbing won't work from one encounter to the next, so you'll have to try F8 (Nearest NPC) or zoom the camera out to physically see if any mobs get away. 

 Threat Meter - This is a newer addition to the game and it's good for tanking groups of mobs.  When you tab to each mob, ensure you are still 100.   The mob with the highest number underneath it, is the mob most likely to go to someone else.   If you notice the little number beneath the 100 is rising fast, like in the 80's or 90's, that means someone in the group has ALMOST as much hate as you, so pull out all the stops to keep that mob on you!

 IF you loose aggro - Hit your back attack, as you will have the mobs back, and that attack does major damage.   If that fails you can try Devastation Fist, as that also does crazy high damage.  If that doesn't work you always have rescue available, but rescue should be your last resport.  I'd suggest using any other Hate positional gains BEFORE using rescue.  There are many other Mini-Rescues available through AA, so if you tank alot be sure to get those when you can. 

Positioning. - Lastly, when tanking you need to make sure you never have the mobs facing the rest of the group.  Some mobs have a frontal AoE, and your scouts will always want the back, for positional based attacks, and to eliminate the chance of the mob riposting their attacks.  Learn how to pull a mob into a good comfortable position that your group can feel good about.   Communicate with them, let them know when your pulling, and you will be great. 

P.S. - Also man, groups usually hate tanks who take forever in between pulls.  be brave, try and move fast.  Ask yoru group if you are going at a good enough pace for them.   They will appreciate knowing that you are a team player. 

Awsome advice i appreciate it. As far as gear i try to have full mc for my lvl im gonna hit 72 in about 15 mins and ill spend some time farming for my 72 mc set and weapons. As far as gear i use the dexterous set of leather armor and use weapons about 2.5 to 3.0ish speed. 

As far as act ive downloaded but not actually used it. I tried using the auto attack timer that comes with profit. Several issues ive had is it seems like im waiting alot for my meter to peak before i hit a ca and so i feel like im doing less dps. Probably not but seems that way and im sure its just a need to get used to it sorta thing. Also often im too busy watching the bar and forget to look at my health and die (lol noob i know)

What ill try to do is tank more lower instances to get practice with it. I figure even if i dont get any aa or anything im still getting practice tanking. Again thank you for the advice. Ill work on the adepts but to be honest i have about 10pp right now and i am usually horrible at making money in this game. 

Here is a quick tip to get your started with timing auto attacks.   If you have less than 60 - ish haste, you wanna hit 2 CAs back to back inbetween autoattacks.   If you have a group thats buffing your haste good and you have closer to 100, or more, then do just 1 CA inbetween Auto attacks.   that is what I tell people who are dual Wielding 2 2.5 second delay weapons. 

As much as you can, have a trouby or dirge in group. Trouby for group dehate, dirge for dps/aggro buffs. I can't stress that enough, having both is even better lol.

awsome advice everyone i appreciate it. so far havnt been able to test it out in a group due to ...well no groups. But anyways question about timing cas between aas. Do you hit your cas as your aa animation complely finishes or when it starts?

Pnaxx wrote:

We generate agro through our damage primarly. So, if we are tanking, we need to stay in offensive stance or our hate sucketh.

Bad idea, you generally should not tank in offensive stance unless fighting easy stuff.  I usually tank in defensive and have no problem with aggro except sometimes with heavy AoE DPS classes, but I just put my avoidance buff on them so they don't die even if one mob of the encounter goes after them.  If you can't hold hate in defensive then try mid stance.  If you can't hold hate in mid stance then your group must be seriously outclassing you in equipment and/or skill.

Tanking in O stance vs Tanking in D Stance, it really just depends on your group.   Do what works best for you and your group.   When you are grouped with some serious heavy hitters, it's going to be very hard to hold aggro if you are defensive, and therefore hitting the mob less.  You should always just adjust to the situation.   go as offensive as you can. 

  Easy stuff - go offensive.  As content gets harder switch to Middle stance if you need to, or even D stance, but I'd suggest going as offensive as you can and still stay alive.  

   Also if you have more than 1 healer, you can usually always go offensive.

Having more than one healer I usually consider overkill.  1 warden is all I need, which also makes it just as easy to hold aggro in defensive stance as offensive stance.

Akodia@Lucan DLere wrote:

1 warden is all I need.

There's where the ease comes from.

Wardens get a buff called Instinct, gives something like +69 to crushing (also slashing/piercing/ranged), which makes holding aggro in defensive stance a lot easier because it offsets the penalties to your crushing that you otherwise would have from switching from offense to defense.

Dirges also get Weapon Boon, which is much the same thing (slightly less skill, group wide though), which also helps the matter (dirges also get a hate buff).

Without either a warden or a dirge in the group (or a coercer or troub for +/- hate), grouping with raid geared dps classes, holding aggro off of them in defensive stance is very challenging. I happen to group with a spectacular mystic, so I can tank most zones in offense stance (also, deadly bane warding from the mystic for more aggro is nice), but certain zones, such as Outer Stronghold and Palace of Ferzhul, hit a little too hard for me to tank in offense stance with one healer.

Conversely, switching to defense stance hurts my hit rate enough that it's hard to hold aggro without burning divide and conquer and control hate every time they're up.

Of course, wardens and dirges fix this problem (coercers/troubs also great).

It's actually been getting better, since more and more of my gear is getting +crushing, but prior to getting some lower end raid gear, it's very difficult to hold aggro in defense stance off of mythical dps classes, assuming you don't have some class giving you significant +crushing or +hate (or -hate to everyone else).