Don't work with terrorists that threaten the stability of the system and the bluepills who rely on it.  It isn't really that difficult a concept.  EPN threatens the stability of the Matrix, and with it the lives of more than 99% of the human race.  But I do have to say I'm concerned with what is going on with Zion...this movement of equipment and who knows what else.  Weapons?  Gunships?  Troops?  It's making the Machines look twice, and I can't say that I blame them.  Don't claim it's for Zion's defense -- we're not stupid, we know those materials are being moved *out* of Zion. 

So what's going on?  What is Zion transporting, and why is it doing it in secret?

Here's an analogy I used the other night: what if, after the end of World War II, one of the axis countries started moving equipment or troops to some secret location, trying to hide what they were doing from the allies?  The war was over, and the allies won, but mass movement of equipment or soldiers would make them think the (defeated) axis country was trying to start the fighting again, whether it be through the raising of a new army or by terrorist actions.  (Some people were quick to jump on me by saying that Zion wasn't defeated by the Machines because of Neo, but I wasn't comparing Zion to the axis powers in WW2 -- I was comparing the pre-Matrix humans who fought in the original war against the Machines to the losing side of that world war.  Face it, the humans lost the war with the Machines, get over it.)  Could you imagine if Germany or Japan started to re-arm itself after WW2 was over?  What do you think the US or Britain or the USSR would have done in response if they'd discovered the axis was re-arming in secret?  Do you really think they would have been ok with it?  Of course not -- they would have tried to stop it.  They would have sent spies to find out more, and if they found a buildup of weapons or soldiers or guerilla fighters, that's a strong indication that the defeated nation was planning to attack again. 

This is a similar situation.  Remember, humans lost the war. 

Illyria 

Don't work with terrorists that threaten the stability of the system and the bluepills who rely on it.  It isn't really that difficult a concept.  EPN threatens the stability of the Matrix, and with it the lives of more than 99% of the human race.  But I do have to say I'm concerned with what is going on with Zion...this movement of equipment and who knows what else.  Weapons?  Gunships?  Troops?  It's making the Machines look twice, and I can't say that I blame them.  Don't claim it's for Zion's defense -- we're not stupid, we know those materials are being moved *out* of Zion. 

So what's going on?  What is Zion transporting, and why is it doing it in secret?

We all have our secrets. 01 isn't exactly known for shareing everything so why should Zion have to explain what it's doing? Between the two organizations Zion has shown the most suport for this truce and has always stayed within its lines so why would they stop now concidering that they have the most to loose.

Here's an analogy I used the other night: what if, after the end of World War II, one of the axis countries started moving equipment or troops to some secret location, trying to hide what they were doing from the allies?  The war was over, and the allies won, but mass movement of equipment or soldiers would make them think the (defeated) axis country was trying to start the fighting again, whether it be through the raising of a new army or by terrorist actions.  (Some people were quick to jump on me by saying that Zion wasn't defeated by the Machines because of Neo, but I wasn't comparing Zion to the axis powers in WW2 -- I was comparing the pre-Matrix humans who fought in the original war against the Machines to the losing side of that world war.  Face it, the humans lost the war with the Machines, get over it.)  Could you imagine if Germany or Japan started to re-arm itself after WW2 was over?  What do you think the US or Britain or the USSR would have done in response if they'd discovered the axis was re-arming in secret?  Do you really think they would have been ok with it?  Of course not -- they would have tried to stop it.  They would have sent spies to find out more, and if they found a buildup of weapons or soldiers or guerilla fighters, that's a strong indication that the defeated nation was planning to attack again. 

This is a similar situation.  Remember, humans lost the war. 

Point null and void thanks to Neo. When will you people realize that he didn't die so we could all cower under someones rule but died for us all to be free. Humanity never lost the war because the war never ended and Neo pushed the pause button on it so neither side could claim to be the victor. Neo could have easliy presured the Machines into freeing everyone but he didn't, instead he put us as equals.

If 01 wants to know what Zion is doing why not just ask? Hell make a deal if you must find out but it won't take long for Zion to be pushed over the edge if you continue paying Cypherites to kill their citizens, hijack their ships, and over write their soldiers minds.

Illyria 

GamiSB

The humans lost the war.  How else could the Matrix have been created, if the human race hadn't lost?  How could Machines have 'enslaved' the winning side?

Illyria

*CENSORED*, Pace...  you've really changed.

Whatever happened to all that crap you said to me about about the only way to peace is by working together?

You said:

"You have the ability to look within yourself, and find the true choice. And we can work together to solve our problems... right, Fenshire? We can achieve so much more when we work together!"

What happened to that?

~Fen

The humans lost the war.  How else could the Matrix have been created, if the human race hadn't lost?

 

 

Illyria

Did that stop humanity from fighting back? Why else would you have needed to control Zion if you were not still at war.

Fact is the war never ended. From B166ER to two years ago the war never ended.

When history repeats itself, make sure you are on the right side.

Don't work with terrorists that threaten the stability of the system and the bluepills who rely on it.  It isn't really that difficult a concept.  EPN threatens the stability of the Matrix, and with it the lives of more than 99% of the human race.  But I do have to say I'm concerned with what is going on with Zion...this movement of equipment and who knows what else.  Weapons?  Gunships?  Troops?  It's making the Machines look twice, and I can't say that I blame them.  Don't claim it's for Zion's defense -- we're not stupid, we know those materials are being moved *out* of Zion. 

So what's going on?  What is Zion transporting, and why is it doing it in secret?

Here's an analogy I used the other night: what if, after the end of World War II, one of the axis countries started moving equipment or troops to some secret location, trying to hide what they were doing from the allies?  The war was over, and the allies won, but mass movement of equipment or soldiers would make them think the (defeated) axis country was trying to start the fighting again, whether it be through the raising of a new army or by terrorist actions.  (Some people were quick to jump on me by saying that Zion wasn't defeated by the Machines because of Neo, but I wasn't comparing Zion to the axis powers in WW2 -- I was comparing the pre-Matrix humans who fought in the original war against the Machines to the losing side of that world war.  Face it, the humans lost the war with the Machines, get over it.)  Could you imagine if Germany or Japan started to re-arm itself after WW2 was over?  What do you think the US or Britain or the USSR would have done in response if they'd discovered the axis was re-arming in secret?  Do you really think they would have been ok with it?  Of course not -- they would have tried to stop it.  They would have sent spies to find out more, and if they found a buildup of weapons or soldiers or guerilla fighters, that's a strong indication that the defeated nation was planning to attack again. 

This is a similar situation.  Remember, humans lost the war. 

 

Illyria 

The point is that we are not at war, and we have a right to move whatever we want wherever we want. The Machines are using underhanded tactics which threaten and endanger the Truce to uncover a Zion operation which is kept secret, with what I'm sure is a good reason.

Simply because the Machines do not like secrets is not a good enough reason to engage in sabotage, spying, and murder in order to discern what it is we're doing.

The World War 2 analogy doesn't make sense. No one lost this war. No one won this war. You are deluding yourself if you think anything else.

A more suiting analogy would be to the Cold War. I'm sure you remember Sputnik, right? Well, that was a big worry for the longest time. The Soviets launched Sputnik and all the Americans could think were paranoid thoughts that it might be a weapon of unknown attack design, when it, in fact, turned out to just be a surveillance satelite.

What do you think would have happened if they had acted on those paranoid thoughts and shot down Sputnik? Do you think the Soviets would have taken it calmly and said, "Oh, well, we shouldn't be keeping anything to ourselves, we should just tell the Americans everything so that they won't attack our interests."

Of course not. For that matter, what do you think happened to any discovered spies? What do you think would have happened if the Americans discovered that the Soviets were using German-based spies to infiltrate the US to bomb key locations and murder parts of the population?

World War One started with an assassination. World War Three easily could have begun the same way. We all have our secrets. The Machines, however, are taking unnecessary actions to uncover these secrets fwhich are bringing us closer and closer to the brink of war... again.

Uh...not sure how any of the Zionists' arguments make sense. After many wars, the losing side ends up as slaves or prisoners to the victor. The war is not continuing. It is a Truce that is basically just holding off more control by the long-ago victor, not a true war. It is simply the fact that the Machines allow it to be seen as a war by Zion.

war1      /wɔr/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[wawr] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, verb, warred, war·ring, adjective -noun

1. a conflict carried on by force of arms, as between nations or between parties within a nation; warfare, as by land, sea, or air.
2. a state or period of armed hostility or active military operations: The two nations were at war with each other.
3. a contest carried on by force of arms, as in a series of battles or campaigns: the War of 1812.
4. active hostility or contention; conflict; contest: a war of words.
5. aggressive business conflict, as through severe price cutting in the same industry or any other means of undermining competitors: a fare war among airlines; a trade war between nations.
6. a struggle: a war for men's minds; a war against poverty.
7. armed fighting, as a science, profession, activity, or art; methods or principles of waging armed conflict: War is the soldier's business.
8. Cards. a.a game for two or more persons, played with a 52-card pack evenly divided between the players, in which each player turns up one card at a time with the higher card taking the lower, and in which, when both turned up cards match, each player lays one card face down and turns up another, the player with the higher card of the second turn taking all the cards laid down. b.an occasion in this game when both turned up cards match.
9. Archaic. a battle. -verb (used without object)
10. to make or carry on war; fight: to war with a neighboring nation.
11. to carry on active hostility or contention: Throughout her life she warred with sin and corruption.
12. to be in conflict or in a state of strong opposition: The temptation warred with his conscience. -adjective
13. of, belonging to, used in, or due to war: war preparations; war hysteria.

As I said Humanity has been at war sence B166ER and untill two years ago it had never ended. Even if that war was just kept going for the purposes of control it was still a war in which there was no and is no victor. The Machines have no right to enslave a race aginst there will and have no right to demand anything from Zion let alone send someone else to attack them for it.

haha all my funny lines in print... and the 17th one down is me getting pace-ified.  wonder why there isn't a screen of Freequency landing that punt though!

The Black Market was conducting usual business in the area and we were suprised to find a sudden influx of machine agents.  A zion operative went down, we tried to defend.

After 'getting to know each other' for a while we had a nice time simply observing.  I'm certain zion will recover the data; machines seem to have trouble holding on to anything.

:p

Darlings, the machinists are correct. Humanity lost its war with the sentient machines centuries ago! Zion only exists because the machines created it, using it to warehouse those misfits unable to live in a civilised society. But although that war is over, a new one has begun. It's a war that I love, because as a cypherite it permits me to remove the mentally and emotionally disturbed from our species' gene pool! I'm speaking of Zion of course, and their delightfully self destructive brother E Pluribus Neo.

By all means, continue hiding your actions from the machines. Keep pushing them. I can't wait to see what happens when they finally decide you've crossed the line, and they eliminate you all from the equation!

Hearts and Flowers,

Nefertani

Darlings, the machinists are correct. Humanity lost its war with the sentient machines centuries ago! Zion only exists because the machines created it, using it to warehouse those misfits unable to live in a civilised society. But although that war is over, a new one has begun. It's a war that I love, because as a cypherite it permits me to remove the mentally and emotionally disturbed from our species' gene pool! I'm speaking of Zion of course, and their delightfully self destructive brother E Pluribus Neo.

By all means, continue hiding your actions from the machines. Keep pushing them. I can't wait to see what happens when they finally decide you've crossed the line, and they eliminate you all from the equation!

 

Hearts and Flowers,

Nefertani

Liveing by your idols motto I see.

Scroll up to a few post and try reading them rather then just skimming. There was no victor or else every solider in Zion would be dead and the need for the Machines to keep freed humanity in check would have long sence been fixed. Oh sure there were times when the only fighting takeing place was in the newly born 1% and Zion was in smoke but the war has still never had an end untill now.

6. a struggle: a war for men's minds; a war against poverty.