My believe system in the Matrix (OLD thread)

**GoDGiVeR** · 02/11/2007 13:36:30

<strong>EDIT: OLD thread. Will perhaps updated along the line.</strong>

This whole thread is all about what I believe in the world of Matrix. Give your opinions please, correct me, give me your thoughts.

Life is, like I love to say, a binary choice. There are at all times only two possibilities: The most and the least possible one. But what if we are not aware of that choice anymore? What if we are made to believe that the least possible choice is the only one.
I speak about our Freedom.

(Warning, this Theory is highly theoretical, based on hearsay from sources i don't realease and my very own thoughts. It can explain alot, but it can still be very wrong.)

(There are points in my theroies that can be brought further, but would reach beyond the Matrix Triology and MxO, I will mark those points as BMx = Beyond Matrix, they can be discussed by you anytime though)

First Part: Freedom and Reality ("The Yellowpill Theory"):

First Question:
How can the Oracle (referred to as Or) predict what happens in our world? How can the powers of the One reach beyond the Matrix itself? (I know these are two questions, they are connected though)

First answer:
There is a theory of physics that says: If you know the position, speed and direction of every particle of the universe, you are able to predict the next position of all particles and this all over again.
This is another way to say that fortunetelling is quite possible. It is VERY possible in the Matrix, because it is done by the Or. But how can she predict the future of redpills, entities that are not connected to the calculation of the Matrix? Redpills can leave and enter the Matrix at every given time. This makes a certain prediction impossible, you might think.
But how is it possible that the powers of the One, of Neo, reach beyond the Matrix? The same way like the Or can predict the future of the Redpills.

The answer is: We are still not free.

First Explanation:
Yes, we are not free. We think we are, but we aren't. It's easy to explain. The powers of the Or and of Neo are connected. They are the powers of Matrix bound calculations. Their powers are bound to the Matrix, which implies that the "Real World" (referred to as RW) is just another Matrix simulation.
You can think about that as a Sphere of Worlds. The core is the Matrix we all know of as "The Matrix" (referred to as TM). It is sourrounded by the RW.
But how comes that we are not aware of this?
Simple as it is. It is explained in the architect scene of "The Matrix Reloaded". To ensure that the humans accept the program of the Matrix, they need to have a choice, the choice to break free of the virtual life. So we redpills get into the RW and think of it as the reality.
This also implies that we are not able to think of the possibilite that we are still cought in another Matrix simulation. It works. There's no information about anyone who broke through the second layer.
There is also a reason for that. I can't say for sure, but i believe that to make sure both simulations run smoothly, they have to be restarted in certain periods. This happens as we know from "The Matrix 2" always, when "The One" gives his code back to the Source and after the destruction of Zion. I know that there already had been several cycles, because of the actual age of the Matrix simulations: Up to 2000 years. This can be said of the age of the Merovingian, who is over a thousand years old. (The Merv knows of this, because he encountered several "Ones" before, Mx Reloaded)
To ensure the safety of the Matrixes, they are given a backgroundstory and a certain length: The first freeings of bluepills till the war for Zion. After this story, both sims are reseted and restarted. Nobodie knows of it becourse the memories of all Humans are deleted every cycle (Not those of the Exiles though -> The Merovingian knows...)

This all changed because of one man: Neo. He made the story continue, safing Zion and the RW. This had a bad effect on the stability of TM. It is all bugged up (Man, Warner Bros. mustn't have planted that much bugs and glitches in the game to ensure that. ROFL) and exile numbers are as high as never before. This instability makes US able to see the lie behind the lie, because we now have time to think about it. Of course to ensure the further stability and safety of US (all humans), the Matrixes can't be reseted by will, so the story has to continue.

First Goal:
A meeting with the Or to talk about this. As the "Mother of the Matrix" she is certainly aware a this.

Second Part: Reality and the Truth (not named yet)

Second question:
Where then lies the really Real World (RRW)?

Second answer:
There is no answer to that. There can't be one.

Second Explanation:
Just think about it. Even if one of us can get to the "RRW", the only way to get there is through the Mashines. But what if even they don't know that their world is just another failsave world, created by others, but now for example completely isolated from Reality, so that not even those Mashines in the "RRW" know that they are not "free". A devils circle.
But how can we be freed, even only to a certain point? Another uncertainty of mine: Perhaps there is a control program for every layer of the Matrixes, with one point of source connected through all simulations. Such a program could be the Architect. He is certainly aware of this layer system, but how far? Such an entitiy could free us. But what would await us then? A deserted world like the RW? I'm positive that Zion is just an invention of the Mashines to ensure the failsave system. And given the actual age of the Matrixes, we can't be sure that there are still free humans in the RRW. If we are freed, i bet we couldn't survive there, not without help from the dominant species there: (Most likely) The Mashines. (BMx)

Second Goal:

To meet the Architect, to get more reasonable answers than in the first goal (intuitive answers).

Third Part: Life and Symbiosis of Flesh, Metal and Code (not named yet)

Third Question:
What can be done to ensure a good, happy and fullfilled life in the RRW, or at least (in the beginning) in TM?

Third Answer:
This third answer is just as theoretical as the other two parts, but it is more about putting into practice of what we heared yet. But all the theories are null and void, if we can't fullfill this third part.
The good thing about this third part is that something already has been done for it. Again by Neo. It is called "The Truce". It gives us a basis of operation. Of course the "Cold War" that is raging at the moment, is very difficult to overcome. Nevertheless, upon the Truce we have to build our future: A Community were every sentient life is equal, may it be of flesh, code or metal.
E Pluribus Neo is doing the first step for uniting Redpills and Programs from every side to fight for the Freedom of Humanity and every life. Too bad, they only think of free life in the RW. But it is a step forwards.

I fight for this from the very depth of my heart. Too bad a faction can't be nonaligned. This would help me very much, showing support to everyone and wanting as less as possible to show I'm modest and ready to fight for what I believe.

Third Explanation:
But nevertheless we have to get to the RRW, to build up a world every sentient being can live in. We have to work with the Mashines to earn us this. We must make us worthy enough to be freed, to help them find an alternate power source and to brighten the skies once again. (BMx)
Living a "free" life is nevertheless only what me make of it. We may not live in the RRW, but this is as best as it gets. Reality doesn't matter there.

Third Goal:
To form a Nonaligned Faction with members of every side in it, with a high council (first rank captians) were everyone's opinion is integrated in the discussion.
Too bad it's not possible. Plus i would have to find enough people to believe in what I believe in. (Who would believe that either way, lol? If you believe in this, please write it in your post.)

This is what i believe in. I want u all to discuss everything u want to. I will participate in the discussion as good as I can. Think about it, take your time.

Godgiver, Cap. HvCrft Symbiosis, Faction: Within Lies the One - EPN (former 420)

420 forever!

P.S.: The two Choices i told you of in the begining were: Freedom and Slavery. The Choice that is true is that we are only free if we know and accept the truth as it is, even if it is hard, that we are not free. To create a happy life we have to accept those who we hated before, which is perhaps the hardest part.
To give more then we are given back. Such a life awaits me in the Matrix.

Xalin

Very intresting points there GodGiver.

**zeroone506**

First Question:
How can the Oracle (referred to as Or) predict what happens in our world? How can the powers of the One reach beyond the Matrix itself? (I know these are two questions, they are connected though)

First answer:
There is a theory of physics that says: If you know the position, speed and direction of every particle of the universe, you are able to predict the next position of all particles and this all over again.

This view of the universe is now outdated, but we're talking about a computer program here, so I guess this would be valid for the Matrix.

This is another way to say that fortunetelling is quite possible. It is VERY possible in the Matrix, because it is done by the Or. But how can she predict the future of redpills, entities that are not connected to the calculation of the Matrix? Redpills can leave and enter the Matrix at every given time. This makes a certain prediction impossible, you might think.

Knowing the human psyche, the whole sitatution in the Matrix with all the details and having all eventualities in her mind, she might be able to know where a certain person (or just a person) makes a certain decision. According to her, this decisions is already been made (because apparently it's the only one that really could be made at this point although the person him/herself might nor realise it), and if she knows all circumstances of this decision, she understands this decision can predict it. If she shouldn't know these circumstances she doesn't understand it and therefore can't: "No one can see beyond decision he doesn't understand". That's exactly what it means.

But how is it possible that the powers of the One, of Neo, reach beyond the Matrix? The same way like the Or can predict the future of the Redpills.

The answer is: We are still not free.

First Explanation:
Yes, we are not free. We think we are, but we aren't. It's easy to explain. The powers of the Or and of Neo are connected. They are the powers of Matrix bound calculations. Their powers are bound to the Matrix, which implies that the "Real World" (referred to as RW) is just another Matrix simulation.
You can think about that as a Sphere of Worlds. The core is the Matrix we all know of as "The Matrix" (referred to as TM). It is sourrounded by the RW.
But how comes that we are not aware of this?
Simple as it is. It is explained in the architect scene of "The Matrix Reloaded". To ensure that the humans accept the program of the Matrix, they need to have a choice, the choice to break free of the virtual life. So we redpills get into the RW and think of it as the reality.

So why do people think the common life in their relatively comfortable normal world of the Matrix isn't real and don't suspect anything in the RW? Is it because the Matrix is programmed to be more spooky than the Real (inspite of all its advantages) and therefore is especially made to appear unreal to a small minority of humans? And then the Real world is made more realistic or more perfect so these people don't suspect anything? Sorry, sounds confusing. imo

Basically, my "theory" is completely different. The Real world is real, but the podborn humans are actually cyborgs. Lots of technical devices planted into their body, and maybe nanobots (like the Borg, in a sense). This could be an unknown way for Neo to maintain a connection to the source or the Machines. BMx because nothing like that was ever really hinted in the movies and sounds far-fetched here, but nanobots etc. are real-life theories about the future of virtual reality and similiar directions, and therefore not so dumb.

Others think it's actually the spiritual level of the Machines that Neo enters. This is a way to much out of genre, but sounds considerable. If you really imagine the podborn as cyborgs Zion's technicians weren't able to register that (Zion isn't the Starfleet after all lol), everything just explains itself without any need for any "Matrix in the Matrix" theories.

Your further points are apparently based on this theory in the first one and therefore I guess I'm not able to anwer those. Looking forward to your reply SMILEY

**GoDGiVeR** · 03/24/2006 14:31:39

Your counter-arguments are very interesting, I hoped someone would do that.

1.CA

Personally I don't think it's outdated, but is quite valid in the Matrix, because it is a action-reaction based simulation.

2.CA

Of course she isn't able to predict decicions he/she doesn't understand. Like every system and every program she has flaws. And especially the humans have flaws. These flaws are best represented by "The One". even the simpliest calculations get out of balance. The action-reaction system gets unstable and makes certain predictions impossible. Though prediction always have a high and low possibility outcome. Most decicions in the Matrix are high outcomes, therefore easier to predict. But the instability and flaws do amke it impossible to do a 100% correct prediction.
But i do believe, if the system was perfect, even human flaws could be predicted more precicly.
But it's not and you're right zeroone5069.

3.CA

This is something i have not thought of and it is a very good thougt.
But according to the Matrix Triology and of what I heard in there, my assumptions are much more reasonable. First the Architect said that the Mashines have destroyed Zion many times and that they're growing more efficient everytime. Second the trainman even knew when Zion "was going to be destroyed" (either good intel from the Merv, quite possible, or it is because of the calculated length of the Zion/Matrix simulation, which the Merv would also know, because of his experience). Third the Merovingian has encountered many "Ones" before. Morpeus didn't knew there were more of them than the "One" who first began to free bluepills and Neo.

Your "Cyborg Theory" is in that way possible that it explains the powers of the "One". But apart from the it's really BMx, sry for that.

"So why do people think the common life in their relatively comfortable normal world of the Matrix isn't real and don't suspect anything in the RW? Is it because the Matrix is programmed to be more spooky than the Real (inspite of all its advantages) and therefore is especially made to appear unreal to a small minority of humans? And then the Real world is made more realistic or more perfect so these people don't suspect anything? Sorry, sounds confusing. imo"

I thought that that would confuse some of you. But it is also quite reasonable, because of the "known" history of Humanity,which Zion possesses (Which would only possess the history, which the Mashines would want them to if the RW is really just another Matrix.). Because of this known history, people are made to think of this as the Reality. And because of this nobody suspects (of course all Zion born humans don't do, they grew up with this history and the knowledge of the Matrix, which they think isn't real, just a simulation. This gives them the certainty to believe that their world is real) that his is just another simulation. Nobodie gives them this thought. This is why the background choice, which is that hey can always choose freedom if they want to, isn't in use anymore. They believe they live in the reality. The choice they think they choose is freedom, but it's just unknown slavery. In the Matrix, many people believe in their unconsciousness that their life is just fake, this choice is lost in the RW.
Of course there is also History in the Matrix, but they don't live in a desperate world where hope is a rare good and where their're thoughts connot be focused on such things, because it would just demoralize the relatively small numbers of humans in the RW.
Desperate Hope is what this keeps this RW trustworthy.
To also reassure that they don't come behind this fake RW, this system has to be much more perfect, not allowing any Exile programs to show up. This is only possible because laws of nature are less likely to be broken or bent, which isn't neccessary, because the Mashines do have an Army with which they can interfere with the Humans, without bending any rules. Only few restricted programs have access to these laws of nature: E.g. the One, and the Or (so she can make predictions, perhaps a side effect, I need further thoughts about this). And because there is no "outside" influence ("Yellowpills" SMILEY

, which could destabalize this simulation. This system is "flawless".
I bet that the mashines could create a more stable Matrix, but because of all the outside influences and the already high numbers of existing Exiles, this is not possible.

Was this also confusing? If I'm sorry, I'm not best in argumenting or putting my thoughts in words. And there are no real arguments in there. To be honest, I can't find one at this time, everything's still theoratical.

I hope that my reply satisfies yours. If not tell me.

Godgiver, Cap. HvCrft Symbiosis, Faction: Within Lies the One - EPN (former 420)

420 forever!

Message Edited by GoDGiVeR on 03-24-200602:31 PM

**zeroone506**

This is something i have not thought of and it is a very good thougt.
But according to the Matrix Triology and of what I heard in there, my assumptions are much more reasonable. First the Architect said that the Mashines have destroyed Zion many times and that they're growing more efficient everytime. Second the trainman even knew when Zion "was going to be destroyed" (either good intel from the Merv, quite possible, or it is because of the calculated length of the Zion/Matrix simulation, which the Merv would also know, because of his experience). Third the Merovingian has encountered many "Ones" before. Morpeus didn't knew there were more of them than the "One" who first began to free bluepills and Neo.

Like you pointed out in the brackets, these facts really don't automatically mean the RW is a simulation. It's quite realistic that both the Machine programs and the Exiles have a significant knowledge about the RW (like the Trainman). Actually like all other humans, Morpheus didn't know about the previous Zions and Ones and therefore accounted Neo's predecessors who had freed the "constitutors" of this Zion as the first one because he thought this resistance was the first one. Maybe that One even had to lie at the humans he had freed, and even if not, the Exiles and the Agents know better than telling the humanity the truth. The Merovingian was there in the Matrix all the time and has access to lots of Machine information, so it's just obvious why he knows about it.

Also, since the Machines control both the Real and the Matrix, they can easily coordinate their actions in both of the worlds, they don't have to be both simulations for that.

Your "Cyborg Theory" is in that way possible that it explains the powers of the "One". But apart from the it's really BMx, sry for that.

Well... it's not that far-fetched at all. I mean look at podborn humans in the movies, they have plugs in their heads and on their whole bodie. The plug in the head undoubtedly leads to some sort of technical device planted in the brain that interpretates the signals and stimulates the according sections of the brain. Apparently it also contains a small computer where all datas about the individual RSI are stored and broadcasted to the Matrix or the construct.

Those in the body are there to provide the body with nutrients. And I guess they can't win much energy out of a human body just by holding a thermometer in the pod lol. It's "bioelectric" energy they get so I bet they also do it by planting something in the body.

Without a doubt, they are cyborgs. The question is how much -- are there really nanobots in their blood? Do they really have hidden devices to communicate with the Machines that they couldn't figure out and were deactivated? And did Neo's programming somehow activate those? By all means, they aren't 100% humans.

And yes, this was only to expain the powers of the One. If you were referring to his or the Or's seer abilities, I bet it has more to do with the Or's knowledge about the RW and Neo's (eventual) possibility to accomplish such complex calculations by unconsciously having access to the source. Although on the other side, the brain has such incredible possibilites that maybe he could also do it in his head (in this case, it would be the Machine technology in his brain and not a hit by a baseball " SMILEY ). Don't know actually, all just jabberwocky SMILEY

"So why do people think the common life in their relatively comfortable normal world of the Matrix isn't real and don't suspect anything in the RW? Is it because the Matrix is programmed to be more spooky than the Real (inspite of all its advantages) and therefore is especially made to appear unreal to a small minority of humans? And then the Real world is made more realistic or more perfect so these people don't suspect anything? Sorry, sounds confusing. imo"

I thought that that would confuse some of you. But it is also quite reasonable, because of the "known" history of Humanity,which Zion possesses (Which would only possess the history, which the Mashines would want them to if the RW is really just another Matrix.). Because of this known history, people are made to think of this as the Reality. And because of this nobody suspects (of course all Zion born humans don't do, they grew up with this history and the knowledge of the Matrix, which they think isn't real, just a simulation. This gives them the certainty to believe that their world is real) that his is just another simulation.

Good point. The knowledge that they're already above another simulation could cause sureness that they're now in the Real world. On the other hand, the knowledge that living in a realistic world can be (and eventually was) revealed as a simulation at all might cause the exactly opposite -- they could get paranoid and simply refuse to believe anything they see.

Nobodie gives them this thought. This is why the background choice, which is that hey can always choose freedom if they want to, isn't in use anymore. They believe they live in the reality. The choice they think they choose is freedom, but it's just unknown slavery. In the Matrix, many people believe in their unconsciousness that their life is just fake, this choice is lost in the RW.

Again the same thing as above -- they're already been taught that their whole world was fake. That sorta unlocks this unsureness in one's mind.

Also, they've actually been detected by Redpills and not really chosen their "freedom". They've actually always been free in the Matrix, apart from the fact that their bodies lied in pods and agents could control them all the time. Now they are offered a choice, do they want to live in this reality or exceed it? Even if they choose the red pill and actually everyone believes this is really the way out of the simulation, this person still can doubt about the reality of the new world he sees. It doesn't mean he consciously and cubconsciously chose "freedom over slavery" and now can't think of anything else. He just chose to escape from the Matrix and can think what he wants.

Of course there is also History in the Matrix, but they don't live in a desperate world where hope is a rare good and where their're thoughts connot be focused on such things, because it would just demoralize the relatively small numbers of humans in the RW.
Desperate Hope is what this keeps this RW trustworthy.

Right, realism benefits from demerits. After all, the first perfect Matrix of milk and honey wasn't accepted as reality. But as I said, a less comfortable reality can be much likelier be taken as something unreal you try to escape (in a purely psychological sense) and the positive things are taken for granted and therefore for real.

People might not want to escape their comfortable life in the Matrix but might refuse the toughness of the Real. Of course, then they want to go back to the Matrix and not exceed this "simulation" like Cypher, at least this possibility is there. But still.

To also reassure that they don't come behind this fake RW, this system has to be much more perfect, not allowing any Exile programs to show up. This is only possible because laws of nature are less likely to be broken or bent, which isn't neccessary, because the Mashines do have an Army with which they can interfere with the Humans, without bending any rules. Only few restricted programs have access to these laws of nature: E.g. the One, and the Or (so she can make predictions, perhaps a side effect, I need further thoughts about this). And because there is no "outside" influence ("Yellowpills", which could destabalize this simulation. This system is "flawless".
I bet that the mashines could create a more stable Matrix, but because of all the outside influences and the already high numbers of existing Exiles, this is not possible.

Assuming your theory is true, this is a very good point.

Was this also confusing? If I'm sorry, I'm not best in argumenting or putting my thoughts in words. And there are no real arguments in there. To be honest, I can't find one at this time, everything's still theoratical.

Nah, you're argumenting very well SMILEY

There are just points where I have a different opinion from yours.

**GoDGiVeR**

Lol zeroone5069, we could do this all over again, by writing counterarguments at the ca's of the other one.
Your point of view of the Matrix is still a very good and unique one too. My view just "explains" some things that have been said in the movies and a bit more. The RW can be a simulation but hasn't got to be one, that's just true. But for the line of argumentation in my theory it has to be one.

Thank you for replying to this, thanks for your compliments at some points. I will think about your theory further.

I hope just that some other guys also reply to this thread, otherwise, there's not much for me to do anymore, because my own thinking about this theory is somehow at a dead end. I just need more intel and thoughts of others.

Godgiver, Cap. HvCrft Symbiosis, Faction: Within Lies The One - EPN (former 420)

420 forever!

**zeroone506**

Lol, that's weird, to me it's completely different: My "theory" appears just logical to me while your version about the RRW seems to be a really dared (not in negative sense) hypothesis.

However, I guess I've said all I think about it, so I just wanna bring up another explanation that I've seen somewhere different (it was claimed to be a hidden message in the Wachowskis' website but I couldn't find it):

The humans have already won the war against the Machines a long time ago and now are testing them in an own simulation. The Architect, the Oracle and Smith are actually humans monitoring their systems and Neo, Trinity, and all the others we know as humans are the Machines with manipulated mind. And so on.

Very weird and not mine, but nice to think about it and maybe a wilful addition to of your point of view SMILEY

However, don't worry I won't hijack this thread anymore, I've said pretty much everything. Let's see what others have to contribute now.

**Inten5e** · 12/09/2007 08:20:24

OMG...My head hurts

Some interesting points from both of you God, and Zero...and much to ponder...however...knowing something and being able to manipulate it are two completely different things...good luck with your search God

Stay Safe

**GoDGiVeR** · 03/25/2006 07:13:52

zeroone5069, your theory is logical, mine IS hyptheoratical, but your theory can be implemented into mine, because it IS logical. That redpills are actually "cyborgs" is logical, but I haven't thought of that. It fits in my theory very well: As of Neo, he could really use these implants better than anyone, because he was used to manipulate Mashine programs. This would also strengthen my point in not bending rules in the RW, because he hasn't to, the implants do that for him. These implants also must have programs on which they run (Communication devices, data storages and all that sorts). The redpill cyborgs don't interfere with my theory nevertheless, but it is a biological addition to my theory.

About this "hidden message": I thought about that already, to be exact, at my second BMx point:
What if Humans already became free in the RRW, what's the sense in using Matrixlike simulations? One point is what u wrote, another one is simple entertainment. There are many other explanations.
Second possibility: What if humans didn't get free? No explanation there, life in pods just goes on.
Third possibility: What if neither Humans or Mashines rule the RRW? What if cyborgs do? This simluation can be used to train their implants, or mere enterainment, or a kind of competition (also is possible for 1st point) where two sides (zion, mashines) fight against each other. Which would also mean that after one side won, the simulations have to be reseted. Of course to ensure stability in this, nobodie is to tell their real origin. Kind of a spie game.

What u think about that? Would fit i think.

Godgiver, Cap. HvCrft Symbiosis, Faction: Within Lies The One - EPN (former 420)

420 forever!

Message Edited by GoDGiVeR on 03-25-200607:13 AM

**zeroone506**

Especially if it's about the Matrix, I think just theoretizing and bringing up crazy ideas is quite cool, it's just I'm trying not to see more than there is. At least right now, I can't remember any scene in the movie that somehow hints a further layer of reality. Especially since "my" explanation fits so well into yours, it seems a bit artificial to me. Maybe it's species 8472 testing an attack on the Starfleet, maybe just the Kid trying out the holo deck. SMILEY

OK, that was just sarcasm, your suggestions don't sound like that at all, it's just I personally can't recall anything from the Matrix story right now that would make me believe anything like that. In my opinion, it goes BMx a bit, I prefer to make conclusions out of more certain facts. I haven't watched the trilogy for an amount of time now though, so if you bring up some facts I might change my opinion " SMILEY

**GoDGiVeR**

zeerone5069, you are just right. You are down-to-earth with your theory and you're right to be sarcastic. The truth as it happens to be is a matter of perspective. Therefore I must apologize for my harsh implementation of your theory. My words seem to be rude and you seem to be a little upset about it.

About proof. Proof isn't there, at least in the Triology. I couldn't find anything in the Triology, just hints, the things I already said. Too bad my Matrix Reloaded DvD broke down. I'm now looking for reports in the internet.

**bleep**, what I need is a talk with the Wachowski Brothers, lol. I'll just keep on looking for what I think is the truth. Maybe I can get into talk with some LETs someday.

For what I see now, our conversation is at a dead end. You beat me, kind of. I need others to reply to this still.

Which server are you on yeroon5069? Send me a message.

See you jacked in...

Godgiver, Cap. HvCrft Symbiosis, Faction: Within Lies The One - EPN (former 420)

420 forever!

**zeroone506**

No, I wasn't upset in any way. And I can't recall you ever being rude. The implementation of "my theory" in yours isn't harsh, it just demonstrates something:

If, let's say, we're discussing about the origin of Neo's powers in the Real and we have different explanations: I'm saying it's his Machine technology in his body and whatsoever and you say he bends the rules of the so-called Real because atually it's another layer of the simulation. At first view, they seem to contradict each other. But mine can be implemented in yours. That means "mine" actually works anyway and yours isn't a contradicting explanation but just purely "additional" -- by no means in negative sense though.

In case you talk to certain characters in game, just a hint: Just as every other human you aren't supposed to know about the other One's (or have the Machines decided to tell the humans the truth? just came in my mind but I'd say not) or maybe even not about what Neo exactly did in 01. For example, the first question I'd like to ask Niobe would be why she didn't tell anything about her meeting with the Trainman and the "last time". But where should I know this from?

However, I guess you and me have said everything what we had to say about this, so let's see who else wanna join SMILEY

ender1

I like your point of view godgiver but i have a quetion. Now I'm new to the mxo and you may think that I'm am just an uber geek but with your belief are you talking about the game or the world that we live in? And ayone who thinks I'm being dumb here please tell me because I'm pretty people in this forum will think that I am in fact an idot.

**GoDGiVeR**

ender1 wrote:

I like your point of view godgiver but i have a quetion. Now I'm new to the mxo and you may think that I'm am just an uber geek but with your belief are you talking about the game or the world that we live in? And ayone who thinks I'm being dumb here please tell me because I'm pretty people in this forum will think that I am in fact an idot.

OMG you digged up that old thread of mine which i created when I had a (meh, mostly still) naive view on the Matrix. I mean, I hven't worked on the theories much further. I guess I'll do that in the next time though.

<_< Who knows if the real world isn't like that? But if we are caught in a sphere of "simulations" you can never know if you are in the real or not. But no, I don't think that in Real Life. See the point at the end.
There is a MOST interesting movie that shows that theory. I dunno what it's called again. The plot is (i try not to spoil the movie though) that in a world ppl have invented a biological computer (about 40x20x20 in size) and you can have some sort of connection to it by a small port at your neck (heh, similar to the cranial jack of redpills, but way smaller). This opens a virtual reality for the user who connects to the computer. But in the end you'll go like just O_O OMGWTF. Darn it, I gotta look for that movie. *starts up google*

And no, nobody will think that you are idiot just because you are new and have a question. Either way, as I said, theoretically you could transcend the theory to Reallife, but I intended it as a theory of the Matrix franchise.

One last thing though. If you can't decide for yourself if that's what you see, feel, think is not real, then it's your decision to abandon your view of reality and substitute it with your own. Reality is what YOU hold as true. Reality is what matters most to you. Matrix: One need not look for a yellow pill (Outer spheres), when you are already "satisfied" with the red (the "Real World" SMILEY

or even the blue ("The Matrix" SMILEY

one. OMG, you make me think about my own stuff again -_-
I'll start writing tomorrow.

P.S.: Ah, now I remember that I was being a *CENSORED* with zeroone in this thread. Darn myself but there's a thing that I learned from him.