Swords, Explosives, and other weapons

**sontag**

I was thinking as to why swords and explosives aren't a large or even small part of the game, or even the movies for that matter. I think it's one of the System's rules to ensure bluepill stability. Because if you think about it people get shot and stabbed by knives all the time and live, but hardly anyone survives and explosion or getting run through by a sword. So if some bluepill was to stumble upon a couple redpills fighting, and after a few exchanges of gunfire they both leave, that bluepill may believe that either they both missed or they both weren't seriously injured. But if both those redpills had run up and slashed each other or lobed a grenade then that bluepill would be left very curious about how that would come about.

That said i think it's one of the most upheld, and yet not (officially) spoken "laws" as it would be. What do you think?

**LucifersChosen**

First off, I'm going to state that I am totaly ignoring the obvious "goes against game mechanics" and that my points are purely hypothetical and are all to do with the matrix world, instead of RL limitations.

sontag wrote:

That said i think it's one of the most upheld, and yet not (officially) spoken "laws" as it would be. What do you think?

What would "it" be? Not using swords or explosives? I'd have to disagree with you there, if that's what you mean. Swords are perfectly honorable in single combat, explosives, however, are not, and that may be one reason for a lack of explosives. A lack of swords? Perhaps it is just that they aren't practical. Knives and guns are easily concealed from Bluepills (trench coats ftw =D), while a huge sword is not.

Your point about the "System's rules" is, I believe, wrong, as the System can't limit things like that, otherwise Neo and Trinity wouldn't have been able to drop the elevator bomb. However, your explanation lead me on to another point, and that would be that most Redpills know that letting random Bluepills awake would kill them, so perhaps it is just out of caution, but still the Redpill's prerogative.

**Darminian**

Depends on what elements you look at -

If you refernece the movie - vehicular situations lead to a lot of explosions - the truck, the choppper, the power plant.

On the personal level not so much - but a lot of the movies wanted to focus on the beauty of fighting and it's rather difficult to find yourself completely transfixed on the nature behind lobbing a grenade. That being said - look at the games for the matrix - in enter the matrix there's tear gas galore, in path of neo they hand you a grenade launcher and flashes and explosive grenades. In the animatrix there are plenty of explosions though most come from the pre-matrix era.

Not to mention code bombs and code pulse devices, and the EMCP devices - all to a lesser extent.

As for katanas - well to be honest as fast as people are - the best weapons people have in this place are guns, if were 30 feet apart and we can move equally fast - well it's essentially game over- hell even when morpheus uses a katana - he uses an automatic glock with it - and an automatic weapon and a sword are pretty *CENSORED* different in weapon types.

But again look at the animatrix and more over path of neo - there are several levels that consist of nothing more then katana combat which is insane - and the animatrix feature the amazing samurai duel. That being said i think in regards to blades it all comes down to not bringing a knife to a gun fight.

The closest thing we have to explosives in game is area hacking - i don't necessarily want explosives, i can appreciate the system as is - when i overlook the problem points but i will reference a time when explosive were highly necessary.

The blue sky event - where we had to battle people to turn the lights on and off. - battle for light switches.

After the 12 hours i remember thinking to myself, i would have just lobbed a grenade into one after opening the panel and problem solved - not to mention it would probably take out a few sleep walkers. All the same some interesting points, but as per usual game mechanics > expectations and logic.

~Darminian

**Lezel** · 01/19/2008 05:08:52

YES!....

here's my 10 sense

incorporate grenades in pvp so we have to take cover and bring back dive roll, we should be able to throw these grenades also through buildings, you know tearin' *CENSORED* up the way it should be..i think that samurai abilities would be really sweet and logical to the ma trees, as would a firing range for us gunners to excell on our shooting would be sweet aswell, i think usable weapons should hang on the Org Construct walls so we could spar randomly...thats all i can think of atm

\m/><\m/

**Denary**

Lezel wrote:

YES!....
here's my 10 sense
incorporate grenades in pvp so we have to take cover and bring back dive roll, we should be able to throw these grenades also through buildings, you know tearin' *CENSORED* up the way it should be..i think that samurai abilities would be really sweet and logical to the ma trees, as would a firing range for us gunners to excell on our shooting would be sweet aswell, i think usable weapons should hang on the Org Construct walls so we could spar randomly...thats all i can think of atm

\m/><\m/

Are you kidding?

**sontag**

LucifersChosen wrote:

First off, I'm going to state that I am totaly ignoring the obvious "goes against game mechanics" and that my points are purely hypothetical and are all to do with the matrix world, instead of RL limitations.

sontag wrote:
That said i think it's one of the most upheld, and yet not (officially) spoken "laws" as it would be. What do you think?
What would "it" be? Not using swords or explosives? I'd have to disagree with you there, if that's what you mean. Swords are perfectly honorable in single combat, explosives, however, are not, and that may be one reason for a lack of explosives. A lack of swords? Perhaps it is just that they aren't practical. Knives and guns are easily concealed from Bluepills (trench coats ftw =D), while a huge sword is not.

Your point about the "System's rules" is, I believe, wrong, as the System can't limit things like that, otherwise Neo and Trinity wouldn't have been able to drop the elevator bomb. However, your explanation lead me on to another point, and that would be that most Redpills know that letting random Bluepills awake would kill them, so perhaps it is just out of caution, but still the Redpill's prerogative.

Yes my idea was not about the game mechanics but in the matrix world itself.

I meant that the System would make these types of weapons "illegal" for redpill use in the main simulation, not that the system would some how keep us from getting them. I think the system would be able to control something like this, considering that agents track and police where redpills go and do, It would be something like if you did use a grenade then agents would immediately show up to stop you. Also since we are in a populated area explosives would a bad idea not only because of the possible collateral damage, but because they would have to fix the area destroyed as soon as it was damaged which would use more system resources then the Machines want to.

**Lezel**

Denary wrote:

Lezel wrote:
YES!....
here's my 10 sense
incorporate grenades in pvp so we have to take cover and bring back dive roll, we should be able to throw these grenades also through buildings, you know tearin' *CENSORED* up the way it should be..i think that samurai abilities would be really sweet and logical to the ma trees, as would a firing range for us gunners to excell on our shooting would be sweet aswell, i think usable weapons should hang on the Org Construct walls so we could spar randomly...thats all i can think of atm

\m/><\m/
Are you kidding?

No sweety, no stuttering throughout the whole post SMILEY

\m/><\m/

Verrity

Frankly, I don't get it. We saw all number of melee weapons when Neo took on the Merv's guys in Reloaded. But it seems to be a design decision ... such as it is.

From an RP standpoint, I see no logical way to assimilate the lack of weapon choices, but so be it.

**BandaAncha**

well, for RP reasons and all that, maybe sme operatives consdered very annoying have to carry a katana under their coat when they already have a shotgun and a pistols, besides the fact that they can easily kick someone to death

Muse · 01/27/2008 01:04:19

sontag wrote:

I was thinking as to why swords and explosives aren't a large or even small part of the game, or even the movies for that matter. I think it's one of the System's rules to ensure bluepill stability. Because if you think about it people get shot and stabbed by knives all the time and live, but hardly anyone survives and explosion or getting run through by a sword. So if some bluepill was to stumble upon a couple redpills fighting, and after a few exchanges of gunfire they both leave, that bluepill may believe that either they both missed or they both weren't seriously injured. But if both those redpills had run up and slashed each other or lobed a grenade then that bluepill would be left very curious about how that would come about.

That said i think it's one of the most upheld, and yet not (officially) spoken "laws" as it would be. What do you think?

Actually, they are.

**MetaLogic**

Muse wrote:

sontag wrote:
I was thinking as to why swords and explosives aren't a large or even small part of the game, or even the movies for that matter. I think it's one of the System's rules to ensure bluepill stability. Because if you think about it people get shot and stabbed by knives all the time and live, but hardly anyone survives and explosion or getting run through by a sword. So if some bluepill was to stumble upon a couple redpills fighting, and after a few exchanges of gunfire they both leave, that bluepill may believe that either they both missed or they both weren't seriously injured. But if both those redpills had run up and slashed each other or lobed a grenade then that bluepill would be left very curious about how that would come about.

That said i think it's one of the most upheld, and yet not (officially) spoken "laws" as it would be. What do you think?

Actually, they are.

Are those Photoshopped?

**CrimsonKiller01**

Something I thought along the lines of explosives was a sort of mine you can set on the floor like a Pandora's box. It would have some sort of proximity detection and if you got too close...BOOM. To give the victim or victims a fighting chance the mines could be set to take out half on the health bar. To get these mines you would naturally have to go about it much in the same way you get a Pandora box.

The thing i liked the most about this idea was the possibilities. You could trap a rival faction in building, club , stairwell..etc
You could also use it to shake off pursuit and what not.

I'm not sure that with the game mechanics we have it would be possible to create something like that, but it would be sure nice to have it if it is.

Muse

MetaLogic wrote:

Muse wrote:
sontag wrote:
I was thinking as to why swords and explosives aren't a large or even small part of the game, or even the movies for that matter. I think it's one of the System's rules to ensure bluepill stability. Because if you think about it people get shot and stabbed by knives all the time and live, but hardly anyone survives and explosion or getting run through by a sword. So if some bluepill was to stumble upon a couple redpills fighting, and after a few exchanges of gunfire they both leave, that bluepill may believe that either they both missed or they both weren't seriously injured. But if both those redpills had run up and slashed each other or lobed a grenade then that bluepill would be left very curious about how that would come about.

That said i think it's one of the most upheld, and yet not (officially) spoken "laws" as it would be. What do you think?

Actually, they are.
Are those Photoshopped?

The text part is.

**UniToxic**

Lezel wrote:

YES!....
here's my 10 sense
incorporate grenades in pvp so we have to take cover and bring back dive roll, we should be able to throw these grenades also through buildings, you know tearin' *CENSORED* up the way it should be..i think that samurai abilities would be really sweet and logical to the ma trees, as would a firing range for us gunners to excell on our shooting would be sweet aswell, i think usable weapons should hang on the Org Construct walls so we could spar randomly...thats all i can think of atm

\m/><\m/

You mam need a FPS to play.

**GoDGiVeR** · 02/07/2008 22:42:16

Muse wrote:

MetaLogic wrote:
Muse wrote:
sontag wrote:
I was thinking as to why swords and explosives aren't a large or even small part of the game, or even the movies for that matter. I think it's one of the System's rules to ensure bluepill stability. Because if you think about it people get shot and stabbed by knives all the time and live, but hardly anyone survives and explosion or getting run through by a sword. So if some bluepill was to stumble upon a couple redpills fighting, and after a few exchanges of gunfire they both leave, that bluepill may believe that either they both missed or they both weren't seriously injured. But if both those redpills had run up and slashed each other or lobed a grenade then that bluepill would be left very curious about how that would come about.

That said i think it's one of the most upheld, and yet not (officially) spoken "laws" as it would be. What do you think?

Actually, they are.
Are those Photoshopped?

The text part is.

The grenade one is from the grenade thread from a few month ago, where they demanded a full fledged grenade tree -_-
So the grenade icon is from an MxO fansite kit. The other 2 probably too, or player made.