Update 42 Hotfix Discussion Thread

PixelHobo

I'm going to agree with the radius buffs not working correctly. I did the test as well and saw no difference in the radius with and without. This nerf was excessive but at the same time the radius before was insane. It was like I ordered a Whopper before CR2.0, saw the Double Whopper in CR2.0, and then given a cheeseburger in the end.

:smileysad:

personlll

I would like to recieve a refund for my Hyper-Strength ability.
Unfortunately I cannot find it in my code archive. Could you
please resolve this issue.

**Rexxhavukk**

I agree with the previous posters that the Howitzer/Artillerist area nerf was too much. It was really a blast the way it was.

With such liberal red frag drops I know it must be nerfed. However,

Devs,...after the 25th p l e a s e give us our radii back

Message Edited by Rexxhavukk on 04-14-2006 09:51 PM
Message edited by Rexxhavukk on 04/14/2006 20:51:11.

Miggesch

Rexxhavukk wrote:

I agree with the previous posters that the Howitzer/Artillerist area nerf was too much. It was really a blast the way it was.

With such liberal red frag drops I know it must be nerfed. However,

Devs,...after the 25th p l e a s e give us our radii back

Message Edited by Rexxhavukk on 04-14-2006 09:51 PM

Correct me if I am wrong - but I also didn't read anything about a change to the radius in the patch notes.

**Tzah**

Well I`m gonna jump on the bandwagon also and say I too went hacker since cr2 went

live and while the radius was very excessive and did need toned down just a tad,,

u toned it down way way way way too much,, for god sake,, 66% (was 80%)

debuff radius bonus and your lucky if it does as previously stated in above posts

circle 6 to 10 metres round the target,, your radius should extend to at least the

distance u hav to be to cast on a target.

stop crapping on hackers,, we have it hard enuf without you further demising us,,

what will simply happen in the end is no one will play as hackers.. u might have

noticed if you pay attention almost every person in the matrix is now either ma/guns or spy.

(cr2 the ma/gun/spy update)

look weve improved this to spy this to this and this too that and weve crapped on hacker again...

IS regen is a joke, radius is a joke,, and hacker style u can do 1 damage

with a punch,, woooo forgive me for not falling off my seat in excitment,,

with parts from all the attack hacker trees loaded to help boost stuff it still

sucks after your oh so great update,, plz stop nerfing the hackers and give

us a chance to actually fight,, pvp backup u say? I dont wanna be backup ,,

i wanna be right out there in the front row ready to kill.

Further to this regarding the selling of abilities,, personally I`d say leave the

frags at the higher drop rate,, maybe turn it down just a little and remove the

selling of abilities after a period of time once everyone has had a chance to

see what they like.

Message Edited by Tzahrkiya on 04-16-2006 06:13 AM
Message edited by Tzah on 04/15/2006 21:13:34.

cryshal

hacker has been nerfed too much. pls increase our concentration and is regen a tad, and adjust some of these timers. timers were made a bit too long, it staggers the gameplay while you sit there staring at it hoping you wont be interrupted, even tho you usually are. and the thing about howitzer radius goes without saying. the rest of the hotfix seems good =D doublecheck the spy nerf, maybe its too severe. you guys really should go easy on the nerf bat from now on..

**r3spon5e**

Hacker Viral Area Radius Nerfed? What Nerf? This was a bug that was fixed not a nerf tha was applied. The bug was having debuff and buff area radius bonuses affect viral area radiuses. So now that the bug has been fixed, hacker viral area radii are what they are and don't get enlarged by debuff and buff area radiuses.

FYI:

23% viral area radius bonus applied to a 3m radius has no effect because .23 x 3 < 1. You will need 34% viral area radius bonus to increase a 3m viral radius and 25% bonus to enlarge a 4m radius.

Final word:

Learn some strategy. I have no problem finding ways to draw exiles into a tight group so my area virals hit them all. Area hackers are weak in PvP for offense and very powerful in PvP for downgrades so if you want to be a solo AOE slaughterhouse, you'll just be disappointed. If you wanna downgrade everyone in Mara you'll have fun. Use Ballista for offense. And if anyone says I'm a howitzer and don't have ballista, I'm so gonna lmao rofl and say 'get a clue noob': this is not a one load game, if you treat it that way, it's your disadvantage and not a fault of the game.

Eveyone complains about nerfing when all that has happened is things have been fixed so they work the way they're supposed to. Area viral attack radii were not changed. They are what they are. Was 3 meters before CR2, is 3 meters after CR2.

.....there's a lot of questions in this thread that would be easily answered by reading the patch notes (and rereading carefully when you don't understand something) and checking the info and stats in your status window. If you can read this thread, then you can read the patch notes and your status window.

Cryshal, if you want your concentration increased. level it up. If you wnant your IS regen faster, put some more points in Vitality. That's where increases to those things come from.

It's a good patch that fixed many things and there are still many things to fix. Too bad nobody tested hacker load on the QA server. Guess everyone thought it was more important to find the best load to win in duels and PvP with than to actually test everything. I used hacker on QA and use it now and find it works quite fine (if you take the time to figure out how to use it well).

Neuro Dart needs to have a longer timer. 90 seconds would be about right since most other abs like this have a reuse timer that is three times as long as the effect. Reducing movement speed makes interlock impossible agains a knifethorwer so even tho the other effects don't last as long, 30 secs on movement speed is brutal without a 90 sec reuse timer and is rediulous with an 18 sec timer since that means you will be kept perpetually at -75% movement speed.

And the style stacking bug needs to fixed ASAP.

These are far more serious issues than hacker area virals no longer being affected by debuff and buff area radius bonuses.

cryshal

wow, "you're wrong" in the form of several paragraphs. im the biggest nerd in this game, silly boy, dont propose to quote percentages to me. the howitzer abs are currently nerfed yes, even if just in relation to practical considerations. in other words, an 'area' effect should affect a bare minimum amount of area (currently not being reached) to even be of use. also, the influences are not being applied, thats quite clear. so basically we're getting whats granted by the ab but our bonuses arent being applied. one bug replaced another. i know why it was huge before, integers were being substituted for percentages and just added to the base numbers provided by the abs. pretty simple. but now, theyre still not working correctly, this is a plain and simple fact. if you need to rain on someones parade i can introduce you to however many overpowered MA's. you do however earn points for your post showing no evidence of 'pwnt' or 'leet' or anything of the sort =D

Miggesch

cryshal wrote:
wow, "you're wrong" in the form of several paragraphs. im the biggest nerd in this game, silly boy, dont propose to quote percentages to me. the howitzer abs are currently nerfed yes, even if just in relation to practical considerations. in other words, an 'area' effect should affect a bare minimum amount of area (currently not being reached) to even be of use. also, the influences are not being applied, thats quite clear. so basically we're getting whats granted by the ab but our bonuses arent being applied. one bug replaced another. i know why it was huge before, integers were being substituted for percentages and just added to the base numbers provided by the abs. pretty simple. but now, theyre still not working correctly, this is a plain and simple fact. if you need to rain on someones parade i can introduce you to however many overpowered MA's. you do however earn points for your post showing no evidence of 'pwnt' or 'leet' or anything of the sort =D

Agreed - if I area hack an NPC in interlock even the surrounding NPCs standing right next to me are not affected.

**Tzah**

Hey Miggesch

Regarding what you said about area not effecting an npc standing beside you whilst in interlock,, Theres a small bug at the moment with viral attacks,, I`ve noticed it more so the last few days while I`ve been farming red frags,, mainly from brothers of destiny and the runners gangs,, (i`m testing to see if it applies to all gangs at the mo)

What happens is you launch an attack,, u go through the movement, it activates your timer for reuse and then you dont see the red flash from the hit,, infact you dont get a hit at all, but the npc does then begin attacking you. Its a bit like the evade bug except the npc freely moves and attacks and is invulnerable to any viral attack outside of interlock, only then if you enter interlock with that npc will your viral attack actually hit. (and as u say, other npcs around do at times get this bug cozing your radius attacks again not to hit) This bug doesnt happen every single time with an npc and it seems quite random although it is very very common. (1 in 3 chance actually)

This doesnt seem to apply to mission npcs only to gangs, I have already submitted a bug report.

Advisary

The disarm traps ability can still be crafted even though it has no place in the ability tree anymore.

Canbus

Please keep the current red frag system as it is. If you remove this after the 25th, you're going to have a freaking riot all over your offices. Everyone could spend as much as five hours without getting any red frags, and it's not an enjoyable experience for everyone prior to this update.

Walrus, will anyone *EVER* put subtitles in the 4.2 cinematic? I've been asking about that on the other two update discussions.

Message Edited by Dibol on 04-17-2006 12:32 PM
Message edited by Canbus on 04/17/2006 11:32:27.

**r3spon5e**

cryshal wrote:

wow, "you're wrong" in the form of several paragraphs. im the biggest nerd in this game, silly boy, dont propose to quote percentages to me. the howitzer abs are currently nerfed yes, even if just in relation to practical considerations. in other words, an 'area' effect should affect a bare minimum amount of area (currently not being reached) to even be of use. also, the influences are not being applied, thats quite clear. so basically we're getting whats granted by the ab but our bonuses arent being applied. one bug replaced another. i know why it was huge before, integers were being substituted for percentages and just added to the base numbers provided by the abs. pretty simple. but now, theyre still not working correctly, this is a plain and simple fact. if you need to rain on someones parade i can introduce you to however many overpowered MA's. you do however earn points for your post showing no evidence of 'pwnt' or 'leet' or anything of the sort =D

Wow Cryshal, for the biggest geek in the game, your understanding of stat influences is mysteriously lacking.

There is no stat influence that affects Virus Area Radius. The only things that affect it are the Range Booster ability and clothing buffs.

This is now the third aspect of stat influences and abilities I have had to clarify for you which I don't mind doing but you should save your condescending ubergeek attitude for subjects in which you have better knowledge (or better yet, drop the attitude altogether since it accomplishes nothing in a discussion forum).

Furthermore, the problem with Virus Area Radius was not that it's integers were inverted, but that it was affected by the Debuff and Buff area radius bonuses.

VIRUS, DEBUFF and BUFF area radii are three different AOE types and they DO NOT STACK.

This is what the patch fixed.

If you hit an exile with Code Nuke 3.0 (6m radius) and the exile standing next to her doesn't get hit, that's a BUG. Bugs need to be reported as bugs, not screamed about as nerfs. Nerfing would be taking an ability like Code Nuke 3.0 and changing its AOE from 6m to 3m. That HAS NOT happened.

But apparently there are bugs...

As I said before, the Hacker tree got little player attention on the QA server so now we have to debug it live. Patience and bug reporting are needed in place of screaming nerf.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

cryshal

youre (still) not quite right about the integers. also, the only ones calling for nerfs are.. everyone but me, seems like. have i called for nerfs on certain godlike MA or spy abs? nope. and yet half the game is screaming for the axe to come down on hacker, mostly fueled by the various 17 yr olds populating vector.

instead of asking for something to be made less powerful, perhaps ppl should ask for themselves to be made MORE powerful, to even things out in a more practical way. incidentally, there was a ton of hacker play on the ep server, especially after the hampton gun bug came to the fore. which was fun, for a while =D

and youre ignoring the biggest factor here by a long shot.. ppl just WANT the radius to be a little bigger. its simple not useful at all for something to have a 4m or 6m radius or whatever. show me 15m to start with, and then we might have something of practical use in a combat or even just a farming scenario. the range booster ab should get us a good boost.. if it gets us just a few meters, whats the point? no one will use it, preferring to keep that IS for something else. range boost should probly be 10-15m, with an absolute baseline increase of say 8m, to which influences are applied as normal.

anyone who wants to test these ideas further, ill load kfgm and you load ballista or howitzer and we'll duel a bit, and record a few things that probly wont mean much anyway.

Message Edited by cryshal on 04-17-2006 06:25 PM
Message edited by cryshal on 04/17/2006 17:25:57.

**Tzah**

Theres an easier way to explain this Cryshal without actually going into any figures or integars or any that geek stuff :p

me = top notch hacker who knows the score when it comes to playing with loads

plus 1 gps mission + howie = tonight i recorded an astounding 35 minutes and 13 regens of IS to complete 1 gps mission (i even recorded 1 death (and 1 stuck in combat bug unable to load howie buff) so uncommon that it is)

option 2

me = as above

plus 1 gps mission + ballista = tonight I managed the gps mission in 4 and a half minutes with no IS regens, and no deaths

that simply shouldnt happen, oh and btw thats solo. Its getting to the point where a hacker is more powerful in IL than they are free attack.

un-nerf us soe,, and just to add on to that,, personally on update 43,, did soe simply push it out a week early to get away from the complaints that are mounting and mounting up here?