Moving on up

**MarsNova**

Since there is a truce. Why dont folks from Zion think of a way to reverse what happened to the sky and move on back up to the east side(back to the surface)? Hell the machines could help think of a way to reverse the sky. Well Why didnt they even try to think of that in the first place and just say screw the humans? My brain hurts now.

Sent

I've had some long discussions about this. However, I think the scorched sky is such a key part of the Matrixverse that if were taken away, it would sort of be an entirely different universe. Everything would totally change and we'd sort of be in a whole different ball game. No need to live underground, no need to get the energy from humans.

I see two possibilities of why the machines have not cleared the sky. First is that they just calculated it to be far too difficult of a task to undertake, or initially tried and failed then gave up. Second and closely related is that it was far more "efficient" to just harvest human BTUs in a Matrix than trying to disable a gigantic cloud of electromagnetically charged nanomachines suspended over 200 million square miles of earth.

BTW...

minuend

I would love for that to be the "end game" for MxO. It would have to be the end because it would destroy so much in the process.

Of course, there are a few problems.

There were a lot of nukes used.

The sun has been blocked out for, our best guess is, a loooooooong time.

The earth is biologically dead at this point. It must be understood that the Earth is a "system", removing the sun from the equation is the same as suicide. The Earth will no longer be able to regulate it's temperature through biological feedback, because there's no sunlight to trigger the feedback loop.

There may still be oxygen generating biological life, but even if that's true it'll be greatly reduced. At some point it will be hard to breath without mechanical assistance. Remember the Animatrix scene with the Human soldiers praying over what is obviously meant to represent the last of plant life.

It's also likely to be, or is becoming, very cold on the surface. Why else would Zion be located near the Earth's core? We've all seen that location isn't a benefit to security. Not at all.

The point is the Earth is dead or dying and the Machines are the only ones left with the power to fix it.

There's just no way we could live with the Machines in peace, as a whole. I can't see all of man kind suddenly giving up violence, hate, etc.. Even harder to see considering the past shared between Man and Machine.

We could kill off the Humans not willing to go along with it. Forced "natural" selection.

We could convince the Machines to breed us docile like cattle, but smarter. Selective breeding, like we did to make all those neat breeds of dog that all started out looking like wolves..

We could give up. Allow our race to die and give our wonderful children the planet. This feels like the "natural" progress of events. The Machines would likely wait until they've learned everything we have to offer before they'd allow us to die off. This is the way we all experience the parent-offspring relationship.

We could take the long hard road and try and teach an enlightened view to all of Humanity, but let's stop and think historically how often that's worked... Exactly.

Human nature is the biggest stumbling block to this scenario.

**ShiXinFeng**

Don't you remember anything from Jurassic Park man? "Life finds a way. . "

lol, jk.

Really though, the planet isn't completely dead, or the Machines would be working on a way to leave. With sunshine, terraforming, and other as yet undiscovered of solutions, the surface could be revitalized.

Unless there is some official source that says otherwise?

With regard to humans and machines living together, it would take considerable tolerance and forgiveness (basically a whole lot of water under the bridge) to acheive, but it's not impossible.

minuend

Why would the Machines need to leave Earth if it were biologically dead, considering they aren't themselves biological entities? Tell me again what physical limits you think the Machines have that would require them to leave Earth even if it got really cold, or really hot? Or had no atmosphere.

Maybe radiation would be a problem, but if the sky is blocked, I guess it isn't.

We're talking about creatures made from software and hardware. Software can be stored on pretty much anything. Unless they've changed their design ideals their physical bodies are made up of parts designed to be replaceable, redesignable..

Machines are super adaptable, we are not. It's sort of a one sided doomsday.

"The terraforming (literally, 'Earth-shaping') of a planet, moon, or other body is the hypothetical process of deliberately modifying its atmosphere, temperature, or ecology to be similar to those of Earth in order to make it habitable by humans."

The art of turning what is, in our eyes, a dead rock into a living rock. I think your foot is bleeding.

I do not doubt the Machines could terraform the Earth back into Earth, once we give them a clear view of the sun again.

If we are lucky the Machines also cataloged the DNA of other Earth species, there might be a chance to recreate them.

The Machines show much more tolerance toward us than we toward them. It's hopeful, but as the Machines pick up more and more of our bad habits... Or we push and push harder... Who knows.

**MarsNova**

minuend wrote:

Why would the Machines need to leave Earth if it were biologically dead, considering they aren't themselves biological entities? Tell me again what physical limits you think the Machines have that would require them to leave Earth even if it got really cold, or really hot? Or had no atmosphere.

Maybe radiation would be a problem, but if the sky is blocked, I guess it isn't.

We're talking about creatures made from software and hardware. Software can be stored on pretty much anything. Unless they've changed their design ideals their physical bodies are made up of parts designed to be replaceable, redesignable..

Machines are super adaptable, we are not. It's sort of a one sided doomsday.

"The terraforming (literally, 'Earth-shaping' of a planet, moon, or other body is the hypothetical process of deliberately modifying its atmosphere, temperature, or ecology to be similar to those of Earth in order to make it habitable by humans."

The art of turning what is, in our eyes, a dead rock into a living rock. I think your foot is bleeding.

I do not doubt the Machines could terraform the Earth back into Earth, once we give them a clear view of the sun again.

If we are lucky the Machines also cataloged the DNA of other Earth species, there might be a chance to recreate them.

The Machines show much more tolerance toward us than we toward them. It's hopeful, but as the Machines pick up more and more of our bad habits... Or we push and push harder... Who knows.

Well seeing how Machines cant even figure out how to EMP proof themselves (The military can already do it in the real now). I dont think they could adapt to the extreme cold or heat. Ever tried using a laptop in the desert? The dust and heat fry it with in a year. In extremely cold places machines have to be modified to able to function there. If they are able to modify themselves for those conditions then they sure as hell could EMP proof themselves.

minuend

There is no explanation for why the Machines have not shielded themselves.

It may be that they've done it intentionally to make the fight seem fair to us. A form of control. If they look weak maybe we'll focus on them instead of rebuilding our strength.

Explain how they can have fusion, hovercrafts(is that electromagnetic levitation?!), super lasers to cut through metal, etc.. And still not understand enough physics to shield against electromagnetic interference?

The Machines surpassed our technological level a long long time ago, it's shown happening in the Animatrix.

If you can adapt our current technology in the really real world to work under those extreme conditions... Uh, duh? If it's too cold for them, can't they just install heaters? Or just run electric current through the "skin" layer of metal. Like those heating wires that clear ice off the back window in cars.

Sure, extreme heat would be a little more of a problem. But the sun is blocked.

When they run out of resources to consume I could see them planet hopping.

**MarsNova**

minuend wrote:

There is no explanation for why the Machines have not shielded themselves.

It may be that they've done it intentionally to make the fight seem fair to us. A form of control. If they look weak maybe we'll focus on them instead of rebuilding our strength.

Explain how they can have fusion, hovercrafts(is that electromagnetic levitation?!), super lasers to cut through metal, etc.. And still not understand enough physics to shield against electromagnetic interference?

The Machines surpassed our technological level a long long time ago, it's shown happening in the Animatrix.

If you can adapt our current technology in the really real world to work under those extreme conditions... Uh, duh? If it's too cold for them, can't they just install heaters? Or just run electric current through the "skin" layer of metal. Like those heating wires that clear ice off the back window in cars.

Sure, extreme heat would be a little more of a problem. But the sun is blocked.

When they run out of resources to consume I could see them planet hopping.

Skynet would have figured it out(emp proof) and pwned the machines of The Matrix.