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<title>Latest posts for the topic &quot;Punch Reversal Catch Slam&quot;</title>
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<description>Latest messages posted in the topic &quot;Punch Reversal Catch Slam&quot;</description>
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<item>
<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;Ballak wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Pylat wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;Confuse stops you from even changing tactics (Speed, power, grab, block) and give you a CT downgrade. Stun stops you from using special moves and also give you a CT downgrade.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;After a quick test-run. You&amp;#39;re right, you get a -20 CT bonus from Stun (which in IL only affects your normal interlock rounds), but I couldn&amp;#39;t find anything regarding Confuse besides the switch tactics. It&amp;#39;s in essence, from what I could tell, a powerless that doesn&amp;#39;t allow you to switch tactics, which honestly from the&amp;nbsp;intentions of the game&amp;#39;s combat system&amp;nbsp;really shouldn&amp;#39;t let you switch tactics anyways because &amp;quot;technically&amp;quot; that&amp;#39;s an exploit that somehow is accepted because it&amp;#39;s used so often.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Even so, that doesn&amp;#39;t change the fact that these happen less than half the time (30% on Suicidal, and unknown for the Wrist Throw, but still not 100% as we know it), as opposed to the 100% PRCS. Wrist Throw has 31 DPS with a 65 IS cost, Suicidal with a 35 IS cost and 25 DPS, and PRCS totalling in at 21 DPS and a 40 IS cost. The only thing that seems a little off is the huge jump of IS cost with Wrist Throw, with Kung Fu having Average, Karate having Above Average, and Aikido having Below Average damage which is normal in the differences for the trees. PRCS also has the highest Interlock Accuracy boost of all three of them, at 20 compared to WT 18, and SBF 7 (lol). It just amazes me how this move has a 100% chance to powerless as opposed to the lower percentages (SBF being 30% which is&amp;nbsp;very low compared&amp;nbsp;the 70% increase of PRCS)&amp;nbsp;of the others.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It just doesn&amp;#39;t seem like to me the huge increase in percentage is compensating for one round in which you can&amp;#39;t tactic switch or you might possibly lose due to a negative CT debuff (not like you&amp;#39;d be doing any abilities to tactic switch anyways, unless you&amp;#39;re just sitting on block which wouldn&amp;#39;t matter or grab, which again wouldn&amp;#39;t matter. I actually don&amp;#39;t see why you&amp;#39;d want to change especially for MA when it&amp;#39;s just grabpowergrabpower with the ability spam. It&amp;#39;s rare for people to go for states once they&amp;#39;ve gone past the initial going into interlock round.). &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Comparing it yeah it seems Wrist throw and PRCS should be rebalanced. However that last comment is completely inaccurate for good MAs, which is why syntax has the worst MAs.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 04:57:34 GMT</pubDate>
<author>The Leo</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;The Leo wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Ballak wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Pylat wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;Confuse stops you from even changing tactics (Speed, power, grab, block) and give you a CT downgrade. Stun stops you from using special moves and also give you a CT downgrade.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;After a quick test-run. You&amp;#39;re right, you get a -20 CT bonus from Stun (which in IL only affects your normal interlock rounds), but I couldn&amp;#39;t find anything regarding Confuse besides the switch tactics. It&amp;#39;s in essence, from what I could tell, a powerless that doesn&amp;#39;t allow you to switch tactics, which honestly from the&amp;nbsp;intentions of the game&amp;#39;s combat system&amp;nbsp;really shouldn&amp;#39;t let you switch tactics anyways because &amp;quot;technically&amp;quot; that&amp;#39;s an exploit that somehow is accepted because it&amp;#39;s used so often.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Even so, that doesn&amp;#39;t change the fact that these happen less than half the time (30% on Suicidal, and unknown for the Wrist Throw, but still not 100% as we know it), as opposed to the 100% PRCS. Wrist Throw has 31 DPS with a 65 IS cost, Suicidal with a 35 IS cost and 25 DPS, and PRCS totalling in at 21 DPS and a 40 IS cost. The only thing that seems a little off is the huge jump of IS cost with Wrist Throw, with Kung Fu having Average, Karate having Above Average, and Aikido having Below Average damage which is normal in the differences for the trees. PRCS also has the highest Interlock Accuracy boost of all three of them, at 20 compared to WT 18, and SBF 7 (lol). It just amazes me how this move has a 100% chance to powerless as opposed to the lower percentages (SBF being 30% which is&amp;nbsp;very low compared&amp;nbsp;the 70% increase of PRCS)&amp;nbsp;of the others.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It just doesn&amp;#39;t seem like to me the huge increase in percentage is compensating for one round in which you can&amp;#39;t tactic switch or you might possibly lose due to a negative CT debuff (not like you&amp;#39;d be doing any abilities to tactic switch anyways, unless you&amp;#39;re just sitting on block which wouldn&amp;#39;t matter or grab, which again wouldn&amp;#39;t matter. I actually don&amp;#39;t see why you&amp;#39;d want to change especially for MA when it&amp;#39;s just grabpowergrabpower with the ability spam. It&amp;#39;s rare for people to go for states once they&amp;#39;ve gone past the initial going into interlock round.). &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Comparing it yeah it seems Wrist throw and PRCS should be rebalanced. However that last comment is completely inaccurate for good MAs, which is why syntax has the worst MAs.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Syntax has the worst MAs, yet really there is no way to compare the difference between Recursion or Vector to Syntax, so technically although you may find that true to yourself, that&amp;#39;s just your personal opinion from a tournament rarely anybody shows up to anymore probably because they don&amp;#39;t care about being the best MA ever, imo (no offense). At least on Syntax.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 09:35:52 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Ballak</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;Ballak wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;The Leo wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Ballak wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Pylat wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;Confuse stops you from even changing tactics (Speed, power, grab, block) and give you a CT downgrade. Stun stops you from using special moves and also give you a CT downgrade.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;After a quick test-run. You&amp;#39;re right, you get a -20 CT bonus from Stun (which in IL only affects your normal interlock rounds), but I couldn&amp;#39;t find anything regarding Confuse besides the switch tactics. It&amp;#39;s in essence, from what I could tell, a powerless that doesn&amp;#39;t allow you to switch tactics, which honestly from the&amp;nbsp;intentions of the game&amp;#39;s combat system&amp;nbsp;really shouldn&amp;#39;t let you switch tactics anyways because &amp;quot;technically&amp;quot; that&amp;#39;s an exploit that somehow is accepted because it&amp;#39;s used so often.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Even so, that doesn&amp;#39;t change the fact that these happen less than half the time (30% on Suicidal, and unknown for the Wrist Throw, but still not 100% as we know it), as opposed to the 100% PRCS. Wrist Throw has 31 DPS with a 65 IS cost, Suicidal with a 35 IS cost and 25 DPS, and PRCS totalling in at 21 DPS and a 40 IS cost. The only thing that seems a little off is the huge jump of IS cost with Wrist Throw, with Kung Fu having Average, Karate having Above Average, and Aikido having Below Average damage which is normal in the differences for the trees. PRCS also has the highest Interlock Accuracy boost of all three of them, at 20 compared to WT 18, and SBF 7 (lol). It just amazes me how this move has a 100% chance to powerless as opposed to the lower percentages (SBF being 30% which is&amp;nbsp;very low compared&amp;nbsp;the 70% increase of PRCS)&amp;nbsp;of the others.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It just doesn&amp;#39;t seem like to me the huge increase in percentage is compensating for one round in which you can&amp;#39;t tactic switch or you might possibly lose due to a negative CT debuff (not like you&amp;#39;d be doing any abilities to tactic switch anyways, unless you&amp;#39;re just sitting on block which wouldn&amp;#39;t matter or grab, which again wouldn&amp;#39;t matter. I actually don&amp;#39;t see why you&amp;#39;d want to change especially for MA when it&amp;#39;s just grabpowergrabpower with the ability spam. It&amp;#39;s rare for people to go for states once they&amp;#39;ve gone past the initial going into interlock round.). &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Comparing it yeah it seems Wrist throw and PRCS should be rebalanced. However that last comment is completely inaccurate for good MAs, which is why syntax has the worst MAs.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Syntax has the worst MAs, yet really there is no way to compare the difference between Recursion or Vector to Syntax, so technically although you may find that true to yourself, that&amp;#39;s just your personal opinion from a tournament rarely anybody shows up to anymore probably because they don&amp;#39;t care about being the best MA ever, imo (no offense). At least on Syntax.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;That&amp;#39;s an oppinion of 10 people I know, and the purpose of the tourneys was to see which server had best players.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Anyhow since after 5 threads about rebalancing wrist throw and yet no effect I doubt this will happen either (too tired of talking to the wall, so don&amp;#39;t really care anymore).&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 10:01:07 GMT</pubDate>
<author>The Leo</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;The Leo wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Ballak wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;The Leo wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Ballak wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Pylat wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;Confuse stops you from even changing tactics (Speed, power, grab, block) and give you a CT downgrade. Stun stops you from using special moves and also give you a CT downgrade.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;After a quick test-run. You&amp;#39;re right, you get a -20 CT bonus from Stun (which in IL only affects your normal interlock rounds), but I couldn&amp;#39;t find anything regarding Confuse besides the switch tactics. It&amp;#39;s in essence, from what I could tell, a powerless that doesn&amp;#39;t allow you to switch tactics, which honestly from the&amp;nbsp;intentions of the game&amp;#39;s combat system&amp;nbsp;really shouldn&amp;#39;t let you switch tactics anyways because &amp;quot;technically&amp;quot; that&amp;#39;s an exploit that somehow is accepted because it&amp;#39;s used so often.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Even so, that doesn&amp;#39;t change the fact that these happen less than half the time (30% on Suicidal, and unknown for the Wrist Throw, but still not 100% as we know it), as opposed to the 100% PRCS. Wrist Throw has 31 DPS with a 65 IS cost, Suicidal with a 35 IS cost and 25 DPS, and PRCS totalling in at 21 DPS and a 40 IS cost. The only thing that seems a little off is the huge jump of IS cost with Wrist Throw, with Kung Fu having Average, Karate having Above Average, and Aikido having Below Average damage which is normal in the differences for the trees. PRCS also has the highest Interlock Accuracy boost of all three of them, at 20 compared to WT 18, and SBF 7 (lol). It just amazes me how this move has a 100% chance to powerless as opposed to the lower percentages (SBF being 30% which is&amp;nbsp;very low compared&amp;nbsp;the 70% increase of PRCS)&amp;nbsp;of the others.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It just doesn&amp;#39;t seem like to me the huge increase in percentage is compensating for one round in which you can&amp;#39;t tactic switch or you might possibly lose due to a negative CT debuff (not like you&amp;#39;d be doing any abilities to tactic switch anyways, unless you&amp;#39;re just sitting on block which wouldn&amp;#39;t matter or grab, which again wouldn&amp;#39;t matter. I actually don&amp;#39;t see why you&amp;#39;d want to change especially for MA when it&amp;#39;s just grabpowergrabpower with the ability spam. It&amp;#39;s rare for people to go for states once they&amp;#39;ve gone past the initial going into interlock round.). &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Comparing it yeah it seems Wrist throw and PRCS should be rebalanced. However that last comment is completely inaccurate for good MAs, which is why syntax has the worst MAs.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Syntax has the worst MAs, yet really there is no way to compare the difference between Recursion or Vector to Syntax, so technically although you may find that true to yourself, that&amp;#39;s just your personal opinion from a tournament rarely anybody shows up to anymore probably because they don&amp;#39;t care about being the best MA ever, imo (no offense). At least on Syntax.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;That&amp;#39;s an oppinion of 10 people I know, and the purpose of the tourneys was to see which server had best players.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Anyhow since after 5 threads about rebalancing wrist throw and yet no effect I doubt this will happen either (too tired of talking to the wall, so don&amp;#39;t really care anymore).&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;I could go in a long rant about how those tournaments do exactly opposite of that, but since this thread isn&amp;#39;t about Hidden or his tournament, we&amp;#39;ll just leave it at that, &amp;#39;k?&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 10:08:43 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Ballak</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;Pylat wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;&lt;/cite&gt;I see people use Freedom to Joints rather often when fighting hackers actually. PRCS is not a god mode attack, if it was so God like (As you imply) every MA would be spamming it all over the place, yet they aren&amp;#39;t.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;As a hacker with a fair amount of PvP time under her belt I have to say I&amp;#39;ve seen the exact opposite of what Pylat says here.&amp;nbsp; No one ever uses FtJ against me but certain MAs like to constantly shut me down with PRCS.&amp;nbsp; It&amp;#39;s not insurmountable, but 100% does seem somewhat too much.&amp;nbsp; I wouldn&amp;#39;t advise dropping it to 40 or 50 as Ballak suggested but 70% should be about right.&amp;nbsp; &lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 23:25:48 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Cadsuane</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>I can see what you are getting at Ballak, but the reason I see for the 100% powerless is because of the defensive nature of the aikido tree. The damage is low, comparatively,&amp;nbsp; and the powerless is short, as a user of aikido I would support a slightly longer re-use timer for it, but apart from that I see no other problem, as it has been said, aikido is made up predominantly of state requiring moves, so when in IL the 2 helpful moves until you state your opponent are maki-otoshi (only if you are against another MA) and PRCS, then you rely mostly on the other MA tree or just regular IL rounds depending on your LO. However if you check the trees, most of the good, non-state MA specials are on the same side as PRCS, eg; EFK, therefore if you spam EFK you aren&amp;#39;t getting off any really decent MA specials, and, again, given the defensive nature of aikido I don&amp;#39;t think it&amp;#39;s a very useful tactic.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;To answer your comment/slightly rhetorical q about Freedom to Joints, it&amp;#39;s never used by any decent mkt/assassin in IL because the animation is SO *CENSORED* LONG, by the time you have pulled it off you have had 3 DoT&amp;#39;s, a knife, and a crippling shot on you, otherwise I think it would be used more.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;FAR is a different story, but it really needs to be restricted to IL only, people are talking from the perspective of out of IL, if you are in IL and have someone shooting you with power tactic waiting for the staggered, they are more likely to state you and their aint nothin&amp;#39; you can do about it while IL&amp;#39;d, then FAR comes along and unless you have been keeping a careful eye on your surroundings (maybe I&amp;#39;m slow but I find it difficult to concentrate on all out of IL stuff while IL&amp;#39;ing someone) then you aren&amp;#39;t gunna switch your hypers and tank up on ball def/res, so boom! you get hit with FAR and your health is non-existant, and that, quite un-simply, is why FAR needs to be IL only.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 03:19:49 GMT</pubDate>
<author>AlphaCoder</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;AlphaCoder wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;FAR is a different story, but it really needs to be restricted to IL only, people are talking from the perspective of out of IL, if you are in IL and have someone shooting you with power tactic waiting for the staggered, they are more likely to state you and their aint nothin&amp;#39; you can do about it while IL&amp;#39;d, then FAR comes along and unless you have been keeping a careful eye on your surroundings (maybe I&amp;#39;m slow but I find it difficult to concentrate on all out of IL stuff while IL&amp;#39;ing someone) then you aren&amp;#39;t gunna switch your hypers and tank up on ball def/res, so boom! you get hit with FAR and your health is non-existant, and that, quite un-simply, is why FAR needs to be IL only.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;To be honest, I can&amp;#39;t see why most of the gunmen moves (from a realism standpoint) can&amp;#39;t be done OoIL. Those that require the user to be IL&amp;#39;d are those that make physical contact with the opponant. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;To me it seems crazy to restrict a probably the only high powered, non-physical IL and OoIL move&amp;nbsp;to IL only in a class which, for the most part,&amp;nbsp;is supposed to be a both in and out of IL class, especially&amp;nbsp;when&amp;nbsp;it&amp;#39;s&amp;nbsp;long casting timer and poor accuracy plays a large factor even with high accuracy set of clothing. As for being in IL, if you&amp;#39;re in IL&amp;nbsp;with, for example, a MA and you have HyperBlock activated, you&amp;#39;re just as screwed if a hacker comes along with logic cannon as you are with a gunner and FAR.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;As for PRCS, I&amp;#39;d agree on a slightly longer reuse time and have the chance very high. Besides, technically it shouldn&amp;#39;t say &amp;quot;100% chance of powerless (duration)&amp;quot;. 100% means everytime, so it should say &amp;quot;causes powerless (duration). &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 04:00:37 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Croesis</author>
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<title></title>
<description>This post has moved:&lt;br&gt; &lt;br&gt; &lt;a href=&quot;/mxo/posts/preList.m?topic_id=36300019560&amp;post_id=36300468082&quot; target=&quot;_blank&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;/mxo/posts/preList.m?topic_id=36300..._id=36300468082&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt; &lt;br&gt; Spam.</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 12:50:54 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Presence</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;Vinia wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;AlphaCoder wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;FAR is a different story, but it really needs to be restricted to IL only, people are talking from the perspective of out of IL, if you are in IL and have someone shooting you with power tactic waiting for the staggered, they are more likely to state you and their aint nothin&amp;#39; you can do about it while IL&amp;#39;d, then FAR comes along and unless you have been keeping a careful eye on your surroundings (maybe I&amp;#39;m slow but I find it difficult to concentrate on all out of IL stuff while IL&amp;#39;ing someone) then you aren&amp;#39;t gunna switch your hypers and tank up on ball def/res, so boom! you get hit with FAR and your health is non-existant, and that, quite un-simply, is why FAR needs to be IL only.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;To be honest, I can&amp;#39;t see why most of the gunmen moves (from a realism standpoint) can&amp;#39;t be done OoIL. Those that require the user to be IL&amp;#39;d are those that make physical contact with the opponant. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;To me it seems crazy to restrict a probably the only high powered, non-physical IL and OoIL move&amp;nbsp;to IL only in a class which, for the most part,&amp;nbsp;is supposed to be a both in and out of IL class, especially&amp;nbsp;when&amp;nbsp;it&amp;#39;s&amp;nbsp;long casting timer and poor accuracy plays a large factor even with high accuracy set of clothing. As for being in IL, if you&amp;#39;re in IL&amp;nbsp;with, for example, a MA and you have HyperBlock activated, you&amp;#39;re just as screwed if a hacker comes along with logic cannon as you are with a gunner and FAR.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;As for PRCS, I&amp;#39;d agree on a slightly longer reuse time and have the chance very high. Besides, technically it shouldn&amp;#39;t say &amp;quot;100% chance of powerless (duration)&amp;quot;. 100% means everytime, so it should say &amp;quot;causes powerless (duration). &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&quot; width=&quot;15&quot; height=&quot;15&quot; /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;I&amp;#39;d like to see you dual pistol execution somebody 19 meters away, from a realism standpoint.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 13:07:42 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Ballak</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>No, you&amp;#39;re right. DPE &lt;i&gt;should&lt;/i&gt; be an IL only move, the animation for it OoIL uses only one pistol and the nature of the execution is meant to be close up. Whilst not physically touching the opponant I&amp;#39;d still say that it&amp;#39;s more physical than some moves.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 18:27:32 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Croesis</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;p&gt;So, I was PvPing, and it seems like pretty much every MA I fight that has some of Aikido loaded like LittleLeeLoo&amp;nbsp;likes to PRCS on the first turn of interlock. And then if they don&amp;#39;t die instantly, like to Maki-Okatashi and then PRCS as soon as possible afterwards. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;but guise accordin to dis thred tat dusn&amp;#39;t happan.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;So my point still stands, and I guess Pylat isn&amp;#39;t ever going to respond again so&amp;nbsp;why exactly does (if we compare the other high level moves that are&amp;nbsp;in the same place as PRCS, which concordantly have similar effects) PRCS get a 100% chance as opposed to the 30% of Suicidal and the just random as we know it percentage that the Wrist Throw (although as we&amp;#39;ve established, insane IS cost) has to stun? PRCS has the highest interlock accuracy of all three. Like normal, the Aikido tree has relatively low damage, self-buffs, and high defense rolls with their abilities. PRCS is a low damage, high rolling attack, that apparently gets a 100% effect chance rather than the other two in the other MA trees. Why is that? Yes, Powerless isn&amp;#39;t as good as maybe stun, and Confusion is basically just another powerless, but I definitely do not think that the ability deserves a guaranteed&amp;nbsp;100% chance to cause it&amp;#39;s powerless effect. If anything, the re-use timer should be boosted to 12 seconds, making it in theory unable to be used until 3 rounds later, but I don&amp;#39;t want to nerf Aikido, I don&amp;#39;t want people to never use Aikido because they can&amp;#39;t use a *CENSORED* ability do the nerf&amp;#39;d interlock re-use timers. I just want a non-state ability that can be used in interlock as a regular move to be balanced like all the other effect interlock moves out there that DO NOT&amp;nbsp;CAUSE THEIR&amp;nbsp;POSSIBLE EFFECT&amp;nbsp;100% OF THE TIME. Is that so much to ask?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 18:58:25 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Ballak</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;p&gt;MA needs a nerf&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 23:28:44 GMT</pubDate>
<author>jl10899</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;Ballak wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;So, I was PvPing, and it seems like pretty much every MA I fight that has some of Aikido loaded like LittleLeeLoo&amp;nbsp;likes to PRCS on the first turn of interlock. And then if they don&amp;#39;t die instantly, like to Maki-Okatashi and then PRCS as soon as possible afterwards. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;But, guys, according to this thread that doesn&amp;#39;t happen.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;So my point still stands, and I guess Pylat isn&amp;#39;t ever going to respond again so&amp;nbsp;why exactly does (if we compare the other high level moves that are&amp;nbsp;in the same place as PRCS, which concordantly have similar effects) PRCS get a 100% chance as opposed to the 30% of Suicidal and the just random as we know it percentage that the Wrist Throw (although as we&amp;#39;ve established, insane IS cost) has to stun? PRCS has the highest interlock accuracy of all three. Like normal, the Aikido tree has relatively low damage, self-buffs, and high defense rolls with their abilities. PRCS is a low damage, high rolling attack, that apparently gets a 100% effect chance rather than the other two in the other MA trees. Why is that? Yes, Powerless isn&amp;#39;t as good as maybe stun, and Confusion is basically just another powerless, but I definitely do not think that the ability deserves a guaranteed&amp;nbsp;100% chance to cause it&amp;#39;s powerless effect. If anything, the re-use timer should be boosted to 12 seconds, making it in theory unable to be used until 3 rounds later, but I don&amp;#39;t want to nerf Aikido, I don&amp;#39;t want people to never use Aikido because they can&amp;#39;t use a *CENSORED* ability due to&amp;nbsp;the nerf&amp;#39;d interlock re-use timers. I just want a non-state ability that can be used in interlock as a regular move to be balanced like all the other effect interlock moves out there that do not cause their possible effect 100% of the time. Is that so much to ask?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Fixed.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;cite&gt;jl10899&amp;nbsp;wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;MA needs a nerf&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You&amp;#39;re joking, right?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 00:35:44 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Omega0</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>sbf does around 100 more damage and costs 5 less IS than prcs, so if you really want the 100% powerless reduced you&amp;#39;d have to stick up its damage. Also, even though prcs has a higher IL accuracy bonus, kung fu style has about 15 more points of accuracy than aikido style, so it balances out. And I thought sbf had 40% to confuse, and that efk was in the same position as prcs, not sbf.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you made dpe IL only, it would take away the only decent out of IL ability in the duelist tree, confining its users to IL only, so you would have to increase its damage over all the abilities. This is true for smgs and FAR.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 02:54:16 GMT</pubDate>
<author>pyro20</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;jl10899 wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;MA needs a nerf&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Martial arts need some attention from Rarebit,not a nerf...More clothes,IS hotfix for some specials,etc..&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:09:56 GMT</pubDate>
<author>TonyJaa</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>So LittleLeeLoo uses PRCS on the first round of IL? I have an AMAZING idea. Turn on Hyper Block and change to block tactics, that gives you a better than average chance of avoiding it. You know why it has 100% chance to powerless? Cause it&amp;#39;s damage is shite. If it was toned down and damage increased you&amp;#39;d just have a glorified version of SB. The whole point of Aikido is it&amp;#39;s very defensive in nature, I&amp;#39;d like to see someone actually kill you by spamming PRCS before they run out of IS. No, they use it as a leg up to give them the advantage and use moves from the other trees to finish you off.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Apparently you&amp;#39;re the only person who struggles against this move, most other people find a way around it or change their tactics (ZOMG, ability spam might let you down!), like I have said, try changing your tactics and the way you fight before you demand a nerf.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This move has been out since the start of CR 2 and no change has been made to it since then, there&amp;#39;s no reason now to ask for a nerf cause some people finally figured out how to capitalise on it.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 05:32:05 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Pylat</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>PRCS does not need a nerf in what it does. I&amp;#39;m also not going to compare it to something like wrist throw, because THAT should IMO should have 100% stun.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Using the accuracy of the move is unfair when putting 2 abilities against each other in MA, because as its pointed out Aikido lacks the most in accuracy and ANY ability you use from each tree uses that particular trees stats (it&amp;#39;s why you see the style change). It is for that reason that kungfu moves generally have the lowest number for IL acc boost, since kungfu style itself is a big + for that.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I remember the days of CR1 where ANYTHING with powerless was overpowered, I mean in a MA fight, whoever got powerless or stun on the other opponent first, 90% won that duel (because you could keep looping either of them after that), whereas in Cr2 powerless and stun are far from the be all and end all of a fight, with the right tactics it&amp;#39;s easily negated also.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I still in 2 minds if this thread is another prank on the community.... &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 06:57:13 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Aquatium.</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;pyro20 wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;sbf does around 100 more damage and costs 5 less IS than prcs, so if you really want the 100% powerless reduced you&amp;#39;d have to stick up its damage. Also, even though prcs has a higher IL accuracy bonus, kung fu style has about 15 more points of accuracy than aikido style, so it balances out. And I thought sbf had 40% to confuse, and that efk was in the same position as prcs, not sbf.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you made dpe IL only, it would take away the only decent out of IL ability in the duelist tree, confining its users to IL only, so you would have to increase its damage over all the abilities. This is true for smgs and FAR.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;You bring up a good point. I guess I should have reworded it, meaning that those three are basically near the same type of move, just different variants of each tree. Mostly because if we went on physical positions then there would be in no way SBF would be relevant to MGK.&amp;nbsp;SBF does have a 30% chance to confuse, if you read the ability&amp;#39;s description. 100-200 extra damage honestly in replacement of 100% powerless I&amp;#39;d be perfectly okay with. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;cite&gt;TonyJaa wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;cite&gt;jl10899 wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;MA needs a nerf&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Martial arts need some attention from Rarebit,not a nerf...More clothes,IS hotfix for some specials,etc..&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Agreed.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Pylat wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;So LittleLeeLoo uses PRCS on the first round of IL? I have an AMAZING idea. Turn on Hyper Block and change to block tactics, that gives you a better than average chance of avoiding it. You know why it has 100% chance to powerless? Cause it&amp;#39;s damage is shite. If it was toned down and damage increased you&amp;#39;d just have a glorified version of SB. The whole point of Aikido is it&amp;#39;s very defensive in nature, I&amp;#39;d like to see someone actually kill you by spamming PRCS before they run out of IS. No, they use it as a leg up to give them the advantage and use moves from the other trees to finish you off.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Apparently you&amp;#39;re the only person who struggles against this move, most other people find a way around it or change their tactics (ZOMG, ability spam might let you down!), like I have said, try changing your tactics and the way you fight before you demand a nerf.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This move has been out since the start of CR 2 and no change has been made to it since then, there&amp;#39;s no reason now to ask for a nerf cause some people finally figured out how to capitalise on it.&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;A lot of abilities in Aikido have &amp;quot;shite&amp;quot; damage as you put it. As above, I wouldn&amp;#39;t mind damage increase to balance out a non-100% chance to powerless. People generally never use Aikido solely, they load up to PRCS or possibly Tomo Nage to use the &amp;quot;all defensive nature of Aikido&amp;quot; as they spam their Kung Fu and Karate moves on you while you&amp;#39;re powerless. Since grab-power spam is inevitable, you have a hard chance at beating said rolls unless you que up your own moves with high defense against MA&amp;#39;s. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I have changed my tactics many times, and number one I&amp;#39;m not an Oracle, I cannot predict when certain abilities are about to occur. Number two, sometimes you just lose rolls, it happens. Number 3 plenty of other moves to my knowledge that don&amp;#39;t seem that well balanced haven&amp;#39;t been changed either. Particularly Wrist Throw unless it was changed during the earlier days of CR2.0 when I didn&amp;#39;t play. &amp;quot;Just because people found out how to say PRCS is bad, doesn&amp;#39;t mean they should change it, because it&amp;#39;s always been like this and change is horrible.&amp;quot; I seem to remeber all the &amp;quot;BAW&amp;#39;s&amp;quot; that came from people when Defense was actually fixed, but the community went on. The same could be said for HJ-Beta and Mobius, etc.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;cite&gt;Aquatium. wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;PRCS does not need a nerf in what it does. I&amp;#39;m also not going to compare it to something like wrist throw, because THAT should IMO should have 100% stun.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Using the accuracy of the move is unfair when putting 2 abilities against each other in MA, because as its pointed out Aikido lacks the most in accuracy and ANY ability you use from each tree uses that particular trees stats (it&amp;#39;s why you see the style change). It is for that reason that kungfu moves generally have the lowest number for IL acc boost, since kungfu style itself is a big + for that.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I remember the days of CR1 where ANYTHING with powerless was overpowered, I mean in a MA fight, whoever got powerless or stun on the other opponent first, 90% won that duel (because you could keep looping either of them after that), whereas in Cr2 powerless and stun are far from the be all and end all of a fight, with the right tactics it&amp;#39;s easily negated also.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I still in 2 minds if this thread is another prank on the community.... &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I don&amp;#39;t think any ability needs a 100% anything unless the move specifically states that it does it, and for good reason, if it requires a state and/or it&amp;#39;s a going into interlock move, or if it&amp;#39;s an out of interlock hacker move.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Okay.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I didn&amp;#39;t play in CR1, and if what you say is true than I am greatful it was changed. It&amp;#39;s just I don&amp;#39;t see why the other stuns and confusions are not 100% as well, not that they should be. You&amp;#39;d think that if all the others weren&amp;#39;t 100%, that PRCS wouldn&amp;#39;t be either. If you must balance it for damage or a lowest IS cost, then fine.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Also, it sort of saddens me that you haven&amp;#39;t put the past behind you Aquatium. You can have your&amp;nbsp;personal grudges or opinions for all I care, I just hope that said grudges/opinions do not cloud your judgement on irrelevant topics.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 17:05:34 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Ballak</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>Aikido actually isn&amp;#39;t that poor for damage, the only other moves with notably bad damage is Ki Burst. The point of having a move with low damage and a guaranteed weakening effect is diversity. Otherwise Punch Catch will just be another version of SB. It gives people different choices and options, more damage but less of an effect, or less damage but a guaranteed weakening of your enemy.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As much as there is a chance you lose the roll, the same bad luck could run in your favour and cause your opponent to lose their roll for PRCS. People love to blame the combat system and say it&amp;#39;s super random, but if it that random the same randomness works in your favour.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 18:16:33 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Pylat</author>
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<title>Re:Punch Reversal Catch Slam</title>
<description>&lt;cite&gt;Pylat wrote:&lt;/cite&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;Aikido actually isn&amp;#39;t that poor for damage, the only other moves with notably bad damage is Ki Burst. The point of having a move with low damage and a guaranteed weakening effect is diversity. Otherwise Punch Catch will just be another version of SB. It gives people different choices and options, more damage but less of an effect, or less damage but a guaranteed weakening of your enemy.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As much as there is a chance you lose the roll, the same bad luck could run in your favour and cause your opponent to lose their roll for PRCS. People love to blame the combat system and say it&amp;#39;s super random, but if it that random the same randomness works in your favour.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;30% and 100% is too big of a difference for the damage between both abilities. SB does enough damage as is, so the only logical move is to lower the chance to powerless on PRCS. It doesn&amp;#39;t have to be super-nerfed to 30% to be an exact match of SB, but what about like 50%? I just think 100% is too high.&lt;br /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 20:06:14 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Ballak</author>
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