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<title>Latest posts for the topic &quot;Spy tree and PvP&quot;</title>
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<title>Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>&lt;div&gt;&lt;div&gt;Well testing tonight along with talking to other players strongly suggests the spy tree is now completely worthless for pvp. Sneak and disguise are both fine but the only time you will actually kill an opponent is;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;ul&gt;&lt;li&gt;they are all by themsleves with no friends anywhere near AND&lt;/li&gt;&lt;li&gt;they dont have an evade shield up AND&lt;/li&gt;&lt;li&gt;they are incredibly stupid&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;p&gt;or&lt;/p&gt;&lt;ul&gt;&lt;li&gt;they are all by themsleves with no friends anywhere near AND&lt;/li&gt;&lt;li&gt;they are AFK&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;p&gt;Disabling the evade sheild leaves you out of sneak and the opponent remains fully mobile so can il you or escape before you have any chance to re-sneak or indeed do anything else.....even supposing you get away he would have to be completely insane to just wait for you to return in the tiny window you have to do one more attack. Asking someone to wait for that attack still doesnt help, the most visibly damaging attack will not kill the opponent and his shield will automatically have reset by then; worse the sucess rate of landing the all important spy attack is disturbingly low i managed about a 50% chance of landing the attack and managed to, at best, take 25% of my opponents life before I was beaten to the point of very necessary retreat.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;As for MKT the landing rate was appalling and the range so short that for pvp you are far too vulnerable. Again a lone target is about the only thing you can realistically think of attacking... and you do so at a very evident disadvantage.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I would be delighted to hear from other testers on the assassin and mkt tree but pvp wise this is completely redundant atm and I&apos;m not even sure what to suggest its all too weak, the damage levels, the accuracy buffs, the way it drives you out of sneak disbaling any hope of true stealth attacks and the disable evade surely one done has to stay disabled? Against an opponent with a brain I would have to rate its chance of sucess as nil &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 18:42:57 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Tytanya_MxO</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;p&gt;noticed this to&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;the new assassin tree... your right if they have a sheild up you can disable it and get beat the **bleep** down for your trouble, the all important first strike even with an enemy with no sheild is pathetic, even if it lands&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;its like everyone has detection shades and lvl 50 perception the amount of failed sneak attacks that fail now&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;mkt again another issue you point out, the range is weak&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 20:13:36 GMT</pubDate>
<author>betaprimus</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>You should just have a chance to not get out of Sneak/Disguise/Invis when you land Disable Evasion. That would actually allow you to get first strike on someone rather then having to have a dedicated shield buster help you out.</description>
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<pubDate>Sat, 18 Mar 2006 20:37:51 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Cal</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>&lt;div&gt;I have used this tree to level up from 16 to 50 in the livegame, i loved it and ive tried it now on CR2.0 and i hate it, i want refunded in info and frags for this tree as it is not the initial tree i invested in now! Im looking forward now to CR2.0 but this is a sore point for me, i dont like it and its not the same anymore at all, its a shadow of its former self.&lt;/div&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Sun, 19 Mar 2006 06:17:08 GMT</pubDate>
<author>DillingerFour</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>&lt;span&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;hr&gt;Tytanya_MxO wrote:&lt;br&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;br&gt;Disabling the evade sheild leaves you out of sneak and the opponent remains fully mobile so can il you or escape before you have any chance to re-sneak or indeed do anything else.....even supposing you get away he would have to be completely insane to just wait for you to return in the tiny window you have to do one more attack.&lt;br&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;hr&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Okay I was just talking to another designer and he said that when you disable the evade shield, you should &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;automatically &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;get put back into stealth 1.5 seconds after disabling the shield.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If it isn&apos;t doing that, it&apos;s broken. If the timer&apos;s taking too long for spies to be effective, it&apos;s something we can balance. &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 15:08:52 GMT</pubDate>
<author>HCFrog</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;p&gt;been testing mkt too.  (also note that i am brand new to the tree and using a full mkt and partial assassin build)&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;ya, sneak seems better.  boo to pvp with mkt.  i agree with tat about the range: you have to get so close to a person that they would have to be afk and alone to go undetected.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;also, every time i tried suplex it didn&apos;t break anyones shield; you may need to tweak that up a bit.  also Inner strength cost for each knife is really high.  most are 30, some 40, some 20.  since knives are our best and frankly only weapons, i found myself completely out of IS and having to hyperjump out before being able to kill anyone.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;tried against the 48 mobs in creston, me vs two.  had no trouble killin one, but left with zero IS to face the second.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;so, yeah.  i agree with the op, mkt is pretty useless (for vector) at the moment.,&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 16:14:08 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Bethlehem</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>&lt;span&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;hr&gt;HCFrog wrote:&lt;br&gt;&lt;span&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;hr&gt;Tytanya_MxO wrote:&lt;br&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;br&gt;Disabling the evade sheild leaves you out of sneak and the opponent remains fully mobile so can il you or escape before you have any chance to re-sneak or indeed do anything else.....even supposing you get away he would have to be completely insane to just wait for you to return in the tiny window you have to do one more attack.&lt;br&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;hr&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Okay I was just talking to another designer and he said that when you disable the evade shield, you should &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;automatically &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;get put back into stealth 1.5 seconds after disabling the shield.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;If it isn&apos;t doing that, it&apos;s broken. If the timer&apos;s taking too long for spies to be effective, it&apos;s something we can balance. &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;hr&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;aaaand I just saw on the QA server that its broken &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 17:16:05 GMT</pubDate>
<author>HCFrog</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>I can say I was the test subject I can confirm this too. &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 19:02:43 GMT</pubDate>
<author>lithium</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>Good to know that it ought to be working better. &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;- Void</description>
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<pubDate>Mon, 20 Mar 2006 23:37:16 GMT</pubDate>
<author>EndlessVoid</author>
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<title>Re: Spy tree and PvP</title>
<description>&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;Well I&apos;m relieved to hear that what we have experienced to date isn&apos;t the finished article, I have the feeling as Spy is coming to QA so late in the day it will be in need of most attention when we go live..... Any chance we can lose the timer on disguises btw the constant change of outfits is murder &lt;img src=&quot;/mxo/images/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif&quot; border=&quot;0&quot; alt=&quot;SMILEY&quot; /&gt;&lt;p&gt;Message Edited by Tytanya_MxO on &lt;span class=&quot;date_text&quot;&gt;03-21-2006&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span class=&quot;time_text&quot;&gt;04:35 AM&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
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<pubDate>Tue, 21 Mar 2006 04:34:29 GMT</pubDate>
<author>Tytanya_MxO</author>
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